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Firing Arcs and Turrets


Sean Mudge
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Hey Guys,

I have scanned a few posts here and there in the topic but have found no real definite answer or maybe it hasnt been explored.

I was wondering about Firing Arcs in BCM. Are they supported? Has anyone experimented with this theory. Or do they have no effect. I am talking mainly about the PTA system.

For example the sunflash has 12 turrets. Is that just a nice feature which gives the ship more of an advantage in firepower for fighter escort duty or, is it a result of the squarish design and some sort of compensation for having some turrets blocked from firing in certaing arcs because of the ships structural design.

Let us compare it to a Starwarrior for example which is long and lean but only has 8 turrets. Does this mean the ship has less firepower turret wise or does the structural design of the starwarrior allow its turrets more freedom of fire by not having the ships hull interfere as much with targeting enemy craft andmake its firepower better than it would seem at first blush.

The reason I am asking is that a board game I used to play to exhaustion when I was younger was Star Fleet battles, alot of the tactics of that game were formed around firing arcs and ranges ( It has since been attempted on compuer in the form of Starfleet Command, which i helped beta, btw the game did not do the board game justice, dont but it). I was wondering if the same sort of consideration was given to Firing Arcs in this game.

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Oban, as far as I know turrets can fire in a 180 degree arc on their side.

So, for example, a turret located on the top of a ship can fire fore, aft, above and to port/starboard of the ship. A turret at starboard can fire fore, aft, and starboard.

This I've noticed through observation - target an enemy fighter and hit F10, then pan the camera so that you can see your CC. Wait until your CC fires its PTA weaponry then, using your joystick, maneuver your ship so the PTAs continue to fire on the target.

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Here's a question for ya;

If you target a fighter, and you keep it in front of you, will your PTA system "prefer" to attack that fighter or will they continue to independantly shoot the stuff around you?

Cause I've found that for the most part, missiles and PTA are the only things I can use against fighters (at least as long as I'm stuck with keyboard control ;-P ), so being able to focus yer PTA fire would be a big plus! :-D

Steve

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quote:

Originally posted by Steve Conley:

Here's a question for ya;

If you target a fighter, and you keep it in front of you, will your PTA system "prefer" to attack that fighter or will they continue to independantly shoot the stuff around you?

Cause I've found that for the most part, missiles and PTA are the only things I can use against fighters (at least as long as I'm stuck with keyboard control ;-P ), so being able to focus yer PTA fire would be a big plus! :-D

PTA targets the most imminent threat (usually) so it is more likely to target incoming missles (use your EMD to avoid that).

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Yes use "S" (STT Single Target Tracking) key that will remove all targets from radar and keep only target you are locked

on. and turrets will concentrate only on that target.

Why do turrets even attack missiles.

those things have 5k armor no chance of killing them.

would be nice if they were removed from PTA targeting.

turrets are weak as they are, and have them spread their attantion over useless targets seams like a waist of what little fire power they provide.

[ 12-07-2001: Message edited by: EAGLE ]

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quote:

Thanks good info, but I have one question, have you ever noticed a turret unable to fire in all of its 180 degree arc because of the structure of your ship?

Every CC has a PTA system sweet spot that is effected by the CCstructure and PTA turret location(s).

The trick/hard part is finding this sweet spot.

TTFN

[ 12-07-2001: Message edited by: Gallion ]

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quote:


Originally posted by Oban:

Gryphon

Thanks good info, but I have one question, have you ever noticed a turret unable to fire in all of its 180 degree arc because of the structure of your ship?

Cheers


That won't happen. If it doesn't fire, it means that either the target is out of the firing arc, the turret has insufficient power, or the target acquisition array is already populated by other targets, which then starves that particular turret of any targeting info. Also the turrets won't fire unless they have a very high probability of hitting the target.

The more targets in the array, the more processing that is required. Typically each turret can process up to 16 targets simultaneously and in real-time.

As for the firing arc you mention, have you not seen how turrets work? I don't think you have or you won't be asking these questions. How do you think they can track and firing at a target constantly e.g. from left to right, as long as the target is still acquired and all the above params are fullfilled.

Turrets are not on ships for glitz. I painstakingly, hand crafted each vector into each and every ship, using BCS. It wasn't easy and its not my idea of fun.

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quote:


Originally posted by EAGLE:

Yes use "S" (STT Single Target Tracking) key that will remove all targets from radar and keep only target you are locked

on. and turrets will concentrate only on that target.

Why do turrets even attack missiles.

those things have 5k armor no chance of killing them.

would be nice if they were removed from PTA targeting.

turrets are weak as they are, and have them spread their attantion over useless targets seams like a waist of what little fire power they provide.

[ 12-07-2001: Message edited by: EAGLE ]


Only station turrets have the ability to fire at missiles effectively. Guess why that is.

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quote:

Originally posted by EAGLE:

Yes use "S" (STT Single Target Tracking) key that will remove all targets from radar and keep only target you are locked

on. and turrets will concentrate only on that target.

Why do turrets even attack missiles.

those things have 5k armor no chance of killing them.

would be nice if they were removed from PTA targeting.

turrets are weak as they are, and have them spread their attantion over useless targets seams like a waist of what little fire power they provide.

[ 12-07-2001: Message edited by: EAGLE ]

Thanks for the tip - I'd always wondered if STT had a purpose other than to de-clutter your tracking screen.

Steve

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quote:

Originally posted by Supreme Cmdr:

As for the firing arc you mention, have you not seen how turrets work? I don't think you have or you won't be asking these questions. How do you think they can track and firing at a target constantly e.g. from left to right, as long as the target is still acquired and all the above params are fullfilled.

Turrets are not on ships for glitz. I painstakingly, hand crafted each vector into each and every ship, using BCS. It wasn't easy and its not my idea of fun.

You are correct SC being new, I have never stepped outside my ship to watch the operation of the turrets, I have usually spent it inside the bridge trying to master that area first and practice tracking with my main guns and missles, .. Last night I let her fight by herself, flew her straight into a few battles nice and slow, and watched as the turrets did their thing.

I had no intention of demeaning the intention of your work, quite the contrary based on how detailed everything else is in this game, I assumed there more than first met the eye with the PTA's, Consider your point taken.

Cheers

[ 12-08-2001: Message edited by: Oban ]

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quote:

Originally posted by Carl Burning:

Negative--

In the mp patch you will be able to man the turrets on a station when your docked--

Possibly, for the sake of the station and my docked ship hopefully but it's still on the SC's wish list and not on the must have list if I remember correctly.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Do different ships have more accurate turrets, or is it just a question of rotating your ship?

Im in a Megaron and ive been sitting here waiting for the next mission, while an enemy fighter has been hovering around me for about 30 mins and has hardly taken a hit from my PTA.

They dont seem to fire that often, not when viewing from outside anyway.

[ 12-27-2001: Message edited by: TRD ]

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They will only fire when they have an accurate lock solution. If that pilot is skilled, he's not hanging around long enough for your turrets to get a lock. And once they get a lock, if the target is not in the same position for the designated seconds, the lock will cancel and the turret has to reacquire. It works this way for realism and to minimize the number of AI ticks. The AI processing for turrets (especially on stations) is very intensive and it is minimized where possible.

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quote:

Originally posted by Supreme Cmdr:

They will only fire when they have an accurate lock solution. If that pilot is skilled, he's not hanging around long enough for your turrets to get a lock. And once they get a lock, if the target is not in the same position for the designated seconds, the lock will cancel and the turret has to reacquire. It works this way for realism and to minimize the number of AI ticks. The AI processing for turrets (especially on stations) is very intensive and it is minimized where possible.

Ok that makes sense, oh well I'll just have to send out a shuttle.

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load cheap missile with non-CTL guidance, lock on fighter, fire. Then chase the fighter around. The fighter will first dodge the missile, making himself a sweet target for your PTA if you manage to fly close to him as he dodges the missile.

Sometimes, the missiles hits too

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Another question:

After watching other ships (via F10) jump into a region and head for the ODS, I noticed that that platform seems to sweep its laser beam in a horizontal fashion only, often grazing the attacker along its shorter width, instead of down its longer length, or to track it along its direction of motion for a longer hit. It's almost as if the turrets are fixed on a lazy Susan, sweeping but not adjusting for height.

Is this just because of the ODS? Do the PTA's "track" an object in two dimensions or just sweep along only one dimension? Or am I totally off-base without enough empiracle evidence to back up my observation (it wouldn't be the first time, huh?)?

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I was watching my BC and a fighter in external view a few times, and it seemed to me also that AI controlled guns sweep in a line across the trajectory, pause, then do it again, never actually keeping any sort of sustained fire, but instead just strafing/sweeping. Doesn't really bug me, just a comment supporting SS's observation.

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quote:


Originally posted by Captain Dread:

I was watching my BC and a fighter in external view a few times, and it seemed to me also that AI controlled guns sweep in a line across the trajectory, pause, then do it again, never actually keeping any sort of sustained fire, but instead just strafing/sweeping. Doesn't really bug me, just a comment supporting SS's observation.


...and the issue is what, exactly? (I must've missed something)

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