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An Interesting Perspective


pkzip
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$iLk applauds SC's cleverness with much fanfare - being the suckup that he is...

SC I almost spit up the food I was eating just now... Perhaps you could take your extreme talent to the stage!

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LOL!!! I figured you guys might like that one. I made it up while in the shower*

*Whatever you do, don't ask what I was doing in the shower thinking about Osama. I've got a TV in there and CNN was on! I swear it!!!

quote:


Well I prefer humor to arrogance

What?!?! Arrogant?!? Who?!? Me?!?

Thats it!! Who's got the rope?

[ 09-19-2001: Message edited by: Supreme Cmdr ]

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quote:


Originally posted by Supreme Cmdr:

LOL!!! I figured you guys might like that one. I made it up while in the shower*

*Whatever you do, don't ask what I was doing in the shower thinking about Osama. I've got a TV in there and CNN was on! I swear it!!!

What?!?! Arrogant?!? Who?!? Me?!?

Thats it!! Who's got the rope?

[ 09-19-2001: Message edited by: Supreme Cmdr ]


Uh, oh -- have you been in the "cigars" again, Derek?

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Aramike, I disagree with your view that governments are people's responsibility. A government can be sustained in the power by means of opression, if they can overpower the civil population with their military, and also by propaganda, misinforming and distorting the reality. Sadly, history is full of such examples.

I think you would have to distinguish between governments that are based on a constitution vs. governments that were formed by force. Constitutional governments tend to not do as you described. Furthermore, capitalist governments tend not to attack other capitalist governments because they would prefer to do business with them.

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Guest Remo Williams

quote:

Originally posted by Jaguar:

I think I can find a rope around here somewhere, we can all go to AW and hang Epsilons avatar in commanders square!! LOL


LOL! I'm in grab the rope, and lets find Epsilon.

BTW Jaguar did you receive the private message I sent the other day?

[ 09-19-2001: Message edited by: Remo Williams ]

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And just found out that the letter above has been making the rounds of the internet in many different forms and ways, and it turns out that it is a fake. Good conversation starter though.

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quote:

Originally posted by Jaguar:

And just found out that the letter above has been making the rounds of the internet in many different forms and ways, and it turns out that it is a fake.

From Interview with Tamim Ansary [ current issue #265] :

Unlike commentary on television or in the traditional press, an essay like this on the Internet has to earn its audience reader by reader, sometimes striking a nerve all over the world at lightning speed. It also picks up a certain mythology along the way. I've read that Tamim Ansary is a University of California professor, a politician, an activist. He is none of these.

"The funny thing is," Tamim says, "when people find me, many of them ask, 'Is this a hoax?'

------------------

That's my source. And your source would be...?

[ 09-20-2001: Message edited by: pkzip ]

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Shower + Cnn = Bin Laden Jokes

Therefore:

Bath + Baywatch = ??

( I can't help it that I had Sky hooked up in my bedroom where I can watch it from my bath.....Wait till you hear what my wife says about baths at midnight j/k )

[ 09-20-2001: Message edited by: Fendi ]

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I think a good point for the Afganistan people would be this quote by Winston Churchill.

..."If you will not fight for right when you can easily win without bloodshed; if you will not fight when your victory will be sure and not too costly; you may come to the moment when you will have to fight with all odds against you and only a precarious chance of survival. There may be even a worse fate. You may have to fight when there is no hope of victory, because it is better to perish than to live as slaves."

Perhaps the Taliban came into power because the people did not stand against it.

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Have you ever wonder why there are so many assylum seekers that runs away from Afghanistan? If it was that simple as you say to depose a government even in the early stages do you not think that would have been done already? It is quite known that hardly anybody likes the taliban (even the people of Afghanistan themselves). Those who do idolizes them like the Abu-Sayaf in the Phillipines are exactly the same as the Neo-Nazi in Britain who seem to idolise the KKK....they are idiots. But there is one thing that the Taliban and whatever terrorist group have in common...its a twisted belief system. The Taliban twisted Islam the same way David Koresh twisted Christianity. With that they can control certain group of guilable people to do whatever they want. If I sound a bit incoherant its probably because of mr Carlsberg.

Anyway back to cheering this thread up here is another funny:

One day Adam was feeling lonely so god decided to cheer him up:

God: Adam I will create something that will take care of you, cook for you,clean up for you have sex with you anytime you want and will basically do whatever you want. It's called a women.

Adam: That sounds great but um...what will it cost me?

God: You must give me an arm and a leg.

Adam: Hmm....What do I get for a rib instead?

God smiles and pooof......

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quote:

Originally posted by Jaguar:

And just found out that the letter above has been making the rounds of the internet in many different forms and ways, and it turns out that it is a fake.

From Interview with Tamim Ansary [ current issue #265] :

Unlike commentary on television or in the traditional press, an essay like this on the Internet has to earn its audience reader by reader, sometimes striking a nerve all over the world at lightning speed. It also picks up a certain mythology along the way. I've read that Tamim Ansary is a University of California professor, a politician, an activist. He is none of these.

"The funny thing is," Tamim says, "when people find me, many of them ask, 'Is this a hoax?'

------------------

That's my source. And your source would be...?

quote:

posted by Jaguar:


Uh uh. Thought so. Jaguar, you've now shot your own credibility like a [inappropriate sarcastic metaphor deleted 9-20-01]. When you try to pass off hearsay as truth, expect to be called to task for it. Do your homework next time.

Aramike, please shut down this thread. It has ceased to have any purpose.

[ 09-20-2001: Message edited by: pkzip ]

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PKZIP, whatever, just saw the post, and my credibility is not in question here. the credibility of the e-mail is what is in question as well as this supposed interview.

I still think that it indeed had something interesting to say, and was an excellent conversation starter. But you can say whatever you want, I really don't care.

But there have been newsstories stating that the original e-mail had been changed and modified and that most likely it was not really sent by whom it was said to have been sent by.

If I'm wrong, hey, that's fine with me, but it was not a personal attack on you, but it seems you decided that a personal attack on me was fine.

Well, like I said, WHATEVER DUDE!!! Grow up a little and maybe we can talk as adults...

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$ilk, Steve Schacher, you really do need to read your history.

Ahem, as far as I know, everything I posted was broadly generalized and assumed to be correct, perhaps my statistics are off by a little? The fact remains that fewer Americans fought in the American revolution than lived here.

As for my comments about the dictators coming to power by consent of the majority, I didn't mean support of the majority. If the people sit and do nothing then they support it as far as I am concerned.

BTW I have read my history, just forgot to go back and do my 150 notecards and research paper before I posted on here. Sorry if I offended your sensibilities Kush.

Um, pkzip, I understand your friends point of view, don't understand why you and Jaguar are pissed about that fake email... far as I'm concerned, any email that enters my inbox without being invited in some way (hint don't have FW on your subjects) is spam and is deleted without being read.

Nostradamus did have some pretty accurate predictions, but alot of them are things you can read into and get what you want.

Some would say the same thing about the bible however so we aren't going to get into that.

Um, lighten up everyone... I know here's a joke!

Why did the chicken cross the road?

... Give up?

... to get to the other side!!!

LOLOLOLOL

Yuck Yuck

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quote:


Aramike, please shut down this thread. It has ceased to have any purpose.

OK, everyone, just hold on a quick second...

pkzip: Please try not to take anyone's opinion so personally. That is the very cause of conflict, and I ain't having it anymore. I just read 90% of this thread, and I don't see any indication that anyone was attacking you, nor anyone else personally. The very purpose of debate is to attack opinions, and that is totally acceptable here. This forum has always been open to debate, and for as long as I stay around and Derek allows it, the debates will rage on.

To everyone: I, for one, am NOT going to go around closely moderating debate threads to the point that they are all closed. I don't have time for that crap and neither does Derek or ANY admin/moderator of this board. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think I can safely speak for Derek in saying that this board has ALWAYS been open to debate, no matter how controversial. In fact, I think that even Derek encourages it (considering a private debate we both engaged in recently).

At any rate, this nonsense of taking dissenting views personally stops RIGHT NOW. I'm NOT closing ANY threads unless they are ludicrous and out of hand. And if they are well-constructed threads that do get out of hand, I'm simply going to BAN whomever is responsible for a certain time frame. There is NO reason that we cannot discuss one of the worst world tragedies on here without making it into an attack on each other's character.

So carry on and keep it peaceful. *NO* personal attacks will be tolerated.

~Mike

[ 09-21-2001: Message edited by: aramike ]

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I thought this thread was going pretty well actually. I even appreciated the SC's attempt at humour (although I don't think Derek's going to get a job writing for Fraser any time soon )

$ilk, I was reacting to this comment...

quote:

Most dictators throughout history were installed with the blessing of the people.

A person very close to me fought long and hard against Obote in Uganda many years ago. Obote came to power through a bloody and brutal coup. There were many Ugandans who fought against him, including my friend, who in University organized ralleys, staged protests. One day, he was dragged into a forest, they asked him how he wanted to die. He asked for a grenade launcher. He thought it would be a quick and painless death. They shot a grenade at him, they fired their machine guns at him. Shrapnel filled his legs, bullets peirced his arms and his torso, they left him for dead... and he lived. A young boy found him, brought him to a neighbouring village, total strangers helped him get past one military road block after another, he was able to make it to a hospital, where they had to search for a doctor who was not afraid to heal a 'freedom fighter' with the help of his family and friends, he made it out of the country alive.

He is a living example of someone who actually placed his life on the line for freedom. And he is a living example of how most dictators get to power through brutality and murder!

I know it's really easy to sit here on a forum and talk about what people should do half way around the world. It is another thing to actually do it. And it's a whole lot harder than it looks.

Pol Pot (sp?) murdered MANY MANY MANY MANY people. Most were not even freedom fighters, they were simply citizens killed for his pleasure.

Lennin, Melosivich, the list goes on and on and on. Trust me when I tell you, if you read your history, you will find that most dictators do not rise to power with the blessing of the people. They kill their way to power and the people show a false blessing for fear of being murdered. And even if you are actively working towards the down fall of the dictator, you show a false blessing, purely to keep your activities secret.

And Steve, capitalist countries attack each other all the time. Or at least have done so in the past.

That's it! I'm starting a history class, I'll hand out cards, have pop quizes, nobody graduates without passing Dictators 101.

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quote:

Originally posted by aramike:

pkzip
: I don't see any indication that anyone was attacking you, nor anyone else personally

Roger, sir. I had interpreted Jaguar's misguided attempt to discredit the source as a personal attack on me. I see from his and your comments that I was in error. I will now willingly swallow a "Chill Pill" roughly the size and shape of my foot.

Moving on to common ground (I'm hoping): that was one heck of a speech by GWB last night. I've always thought that he was clumsy, until I realized that I'd not be comfortable with seven cameras in my face all day either. He's turning out to be quite a measured guy. I've got a good feeling about him. Don't tell my democrat friends I said that.

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