Jump to content

Democrats keep putting their foot in their mouths


Recommended Posts

quote:

Originally posted by Prez:

quote:

Unsubstantiated bullcrap.

Ask the families of the 3000 or so people who had their loved ones taken from them how "unsubstantiated" it is. If your blindness to reason wasn't so sad, it would be almost funny.


3000 deaths qualifies as the single most dangerous threat? 9-11 was a tragedy, no doubt. But if you buy the line that terrorism is the #1 threat to our survival then I'd question your blindness to reason.

Think twice. Of course our gov't is going to tell you it's the #1 threat. They need to justify the war under the guise it's a 'war on terror'. Terrorism is merely one if the umpteen reasons why we went into Iraq, it's also the easiest reason to sell to the public.

Terrorism existed long before they struck out at us. Most countries of the world have dealt with it for decades and some even centuries, yet they manage to survive. On any given day your life is threatened by far more mundane things than a possible terrorist act.

It's safe to take down the plastic tarps and duct tape now.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 87
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

quote:

Originally posted by Grizzle:

quote:

Originally posted by Prez:

quote:

Unsubstantiated bullcrap.

Ask the families of the 3000 or so people who had their loved ones taken from them how "unsubstantiated" it is. If your blindness to reason wasn't so sad, it would be almost funny.


3000 deaths qualifies as the single most dangerous threat? 9-11 was a tragedy, no doubt. But if you buy the line that terrorism is the #1 threat to our survival then I'd question your blindness to reason.

Think twice. Of course our gov't is going to tell you it's the #1 threat. They need to justify the war under the guise it's a 'war on terror'. Terrorism is merely one if the umpteen reasons why we went into Iraq, it's also the easiest reason to sell to the public.

Terrorism existed long before they struck out at us. Most countries of the world have dealt with it for decades and some even centuries, yet they manage to survive. On any given day your life is threatened by far more mundane things than a possible terrorist act.

It's safe to take down the plastic tarps and duct tape now.


Grizzle, you need to get a grip on reality as well..

If the UN OR the US had allowed Israel to take the GLOVES OFF with the Palestinians, they wouldn't be having a palestinian terrorist problem, and Araffat the terrorist scumbag, may he rot in hell, would NEVER have gotten into a position of power, he would have been DEAD years ago.

A terrorist is only as good as his cause, and as good as his terror tactics will terrorize people.

The ONLY way to fight a terrorist is to TERRORIZE him!!

If he attacks, HE DIES, if he kills people, then his organization should and WILL suffer.

That organization should be destroyed and it's members killed or captured, PREFERABLY KILLED!!!

Every time a new organization pops it's head up, you destroy it, no matter where they are, and no matter what the UN says.

THEN there will NOT be terrorism, then people might actually go after the political extablishments, INSTEAD of INNOCENT civilians.

Also, you forget that Al Quaeda wants NOTHING more then the TOTAL destruction of the United States, in ANY form.

So, if you wish to kneel on a rug facing Mecca, 5 times a day, have your religious freedom taken from you, have your political freedom TAKEN from you, or perhaps just DIE by their hand.

Continue on with your dreamy little world...

This is the REAL world, people die, people wish to KILL, and they can and will do so....

No matter how many times you say that it is wrong...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not to pile on grizzle, as Jaguar had an answer to you previously, but I would like to respond as well.

quote:

3000 deaths qualifies as the single most dangerous threat? 9-11 was a tragedy, no doubt. But if you buy the line that terrorism is the #1 threat to our survival then I'd question your blindness to reason.


Just think if one of those jets had been filled with vx gas or a nuclear bomb. The devastation would have been orders of magnitude greater. The fact of the matter is we have been lucky. Yes we have been hit by terrorists before, and have you noticed with each attack, the terrorist become more brazen? What would have been their next trick? No one in his right mind can believe that 9/11 was intended to be the end. As of right now, attacks on our soil have ceased, and I believe its because the U.S. has taken the fight to them, not sat back and waited for the next salvo as we had been doing for so many years.

I buy nothing the government says at face value, regardless of what it may seem. Is it so hard to fathom that some well-educated people agree with and support what the government is doing? Just because it is in fashion lately to have some wacko conspiracy theory about the administration's real intentions does not mean that we are naive because we don't. I don't think it does, anyway.

quote:

On any given day your life is threatened by far more mundane things than a possible terrorist act.


I had hoped you would give me more credit than feeling the need to state something so inheritantly obvious. I was talking about on a national scale. Our greatest threat as a nation is terrorism, imo. What is it in your opinion?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

OK, time to pile on some more, since we have been discussing CLUB Gitmo in this thread, I will put it here, instead of creating a WHOLE new thread for it.

Front Page mag.com

quote:

What I Saw at Gitmo

By Lt. Col. Gordon Cucullu

FrontPageMagazine.com | June 27, 2005

Last week, I was privileged to be part of a Department of Defense trip to the Joint Task Force - Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. I got to see the operations of this ÔÇ£controversialÔÇØ facility up-close ÔÇô something particularly important after Sen. Richard DurbinÔÇÖs comparison of its guard to Nazi stormtroopers and calls of leftists to shut the center down. Our group went to GITMO to check out tales that the military was being too tough on these terrorist detainees. We left convinced that America is being extraordinarily lenient ÔÇô far too lenient.

After speaking with soldiers, sailors, and civilians who collectively staff Gitmo, I left convinced that abuse definitely exists at the detention facilities, and it typically fails to receive the press attention it deserves: its the relentless, merciless attacks on American servicemen and women by these terrorist thugs. Many of the orange jumpsuit-clad detainees fight their captors at every opportunity, openly bragging of their desire to kill Americans. One has promised that, if released, he would find MPs in their homes through the internet, break into their houses at night, and cut the throats of them and their families like sheep. Others claim authority and vindication to kill women, children, and other innocents who oppose their jihadist mission authorized by the Koran (the same one that hangs in every cell from a specially-designed holder intended to protect it from a touching the cell floor  all provided at U.S. taxpayer expense). One detainee was heard to tell another: One day I will enjoy sucking American blood, although their blood is bitter, undrinkable. These recalcitrant detainees are known euphemistically as being non-compliant. They attack guards whenever the soldiers enter their cells, trying to reach up under protective facemasks to gouge eyes and tear mouths. They make weapons and try to stab the guards or grab and break limbs as the guards pass them food.

We dined with the soldiers, toured several of the individual holding camps, observed interrogations, and inspected cells. We were impressed by the universally high quality of the cadre and the facilities. While it may not be exactly ÔÇ£Club GITMO,ÔÇØ as Rush Limbaugh uses to tweak the hard-Left critics who havenÔÇÖt a clue about reality here, GITMO is a far cry from the harshness experienced even by maximum security prisoners in the U.S.

Meals for detainees are ample: we lunched on what several thought was an accumulated single dayÔÇÖs ration for detainees. ÔÇ£No,ÔÇØ the contract food service manager said with a laugh, ÔÇ£what youÔÇÖre looking at there is todayÔÇÖs lunch. A single meal. They get three a day like that.ÔÇØ The vegetables, pita bread, and other well-prepared food filled two of the large Styrofoam take-home containers we see in restaurants. Several prisoners have special meal orders like ÔÇ£no tomatoesÔÇØ or ÔÇ£no peanut productsÔÇØ depending on taste or allergies. ÔÇ£One prisoner,ÔÇØ General Hood said, ÔÇ£throws back his food tray if it contains things he has specifically said he doesnÔÇÖt want.ÔÇØ How is he punished for this outrageous behavior? His tray is numbered, the food he requested is put on it, and the corrected ÔÇ£orderÔÇØ is delivered to his cell.

The detainees are similarly catered to medically. Almost every one arrived at GITMO with some sort of battlefield trauma. After all, the majority were captured in combat. Today they are healthy, immunized, and well cared for. At a visit to the modern hospital facility ÔÇô dedicated solely to the detainees and comparable to a well-equipped and staffed small-town hospital with operating, dental, routine facilities ÔÇô the doctor in charge confirmed that the caloric count for the detainees was so high that while ÔÇ£most detainees arrived undernourished,ÔÇØ medics now watch for issues stemming from high cholesterol and being overweight. Each of approximately 520 terrorists currently held in confinement averages about four medical visits monthly, something one would expect from only a dedicated American hypochondriac. Welcome to the rigors of detention under American supervision.

Of the estimated 70,000 battlefield captures that were made in Afghanistan, only a tiny percentage, something on the order of 800-plus, were eventually evacuated to GITMO. These were the worst of the worst. More than 200 have been released back to their home country ÔÇô if the U.S. is assured that the detainees would not be tortured by local authorities upon return. These men were freed because they were deemed by ongoing official military review processes to no longer pose a threat, or to possess no useful intelligence. And this process has proven too generous at times: more than 10 released GITMO detainees have been killed or recaptured fighting Americans or have been identified as resuming terrorist activities. Still, the process is up and running for review of cases, and if a Washington DC circuit court approves a government appeal, the system for military tribunals will get started. All mechanisms are in place and ready to go as soon as DoD gets a green light.

There is a good reason these unlawful combatants are being confined. They are evil and dangerous individuals. Yet these thugs are treated with an amazing degree of compassion: They are given ice cream treats and recreational time. They live in clean facilities, and receive a full Muslim religious package of Koran, prayer rug, beads, and prayer oils. An arrow in every cell points to Mecca. The call to prayer is played five times daily. They are not abused, hanged, tortured, beheaded, raped, mutilated, or in any way treated the way that they once treated their own captives ÔÇô or now treat their guards.

Some questioned whether it were wise to give these radical Islamic fundamentalists the religious supplies that ended up landing them in Gitmo in the first place. ÔÇ£Giving them the Koran is simply something that we think we ought to do as a humane gesture,ÔÇØ said second-in-command Brigadier General Gong. ÔÇ£WeÔÇÖre Americans. ThatÔÇÖs how we operate.ÔÇØ

When we challenged military authorities about the seemingly plush environs these would-be murderers receive, the commanding officers stated this was the most productive course. JTF-GITMO commanding officer Brigadier General Jay Hood radiated confidence and determination when fielding challenges from our group about his overly lenient treatment. ÔÇ£It works,ÔÇØ he says simply. ÔÇ£We do not allow torture or mistreatment, period.ÔÇØ How to they guarantee this? By rigorous, on-going training and constant oversight up and down the supervisory chain. As proof that ÔÇ£establishing rapportÔÇØ with the detainees is far more effective than coercive techniques, General Hood refers skeptics to the massive amount of usable intelligence information JTF-GITMO continues to produce even three years into the program.

You are right to worry about inhumane treatment taking place at GITMO. But your concern should be for the dedicated, well-trained, highly professional American men and women who are subjected to a daily barrage of feces, urine, semen, and spit hurled at them along with vile invective as they implement a humane, enlightened system of confinement on men who want nothing more than to kill Americans. These quiet professional Americans, who live under the motto ÔÇ£Honor Bound for Defense of Freedom,ÔÇØ deserve our utmost respect and concern. Shame on anyone who slanders or disrespects them for short-term and short-sighted political advantage.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Lt. Col. Gordon Cucullu has been an Army Green Beret lieutenant colonel, as well as a writer, popular speaker, business executive and farmer. His most recent book is Separated at Birth, about North and South Korea.


Yeah, the terrorist scumbags are treated SO badly...

Yeah, right....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

First, they have NEVER been TRIED!!

Second, JUST being locked in a cage, FOR YEARS, not charged or tried is CRIMINAL.

How would YOU like that kind of treatment.

NOT to mention the other forms of humiliation and mental and physical abuse...YOU seem to ignore...REALLY HAS been going on....

Jeesh..!!

One can overlook (Lack of Knowledge)Ignorance.

One cannot forgive willing and self imposed blindness!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

first off Street, during WWII, when the werewolves were doing thier thing, they were tied to a fence post and SHOT!!

HELLO, and of the 30,000 prisoners taken during the Afghanistan war, barely 750 were taken to Gitmo, and over 200 have been released.

50 years ago, we would have SHOT them in the field, now we take them to a fricking country club, so don't whine about it.

SHEESH!!!

Nomad, 3 Democrats in the House and Senate have come out and said the same thing...

The Mainstream media WON'T talk about that, so quit with the socalled prestigious crap...

Good Grief, you elitists are something else...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

quote:

Originally posted by street:

Now, here u go Jag:

Im giving you ALL a front row seat, so you can witness a TRULY Informed and INTELLIGENT man speak.

lol

Yeah, right, I think that I will go throw up now.

The man was right about some things, but others, OMG, CLUELESS....

Not surprising, because he wasn't involved in the runup to Iraqi Freedom, and is upset because his side, a larger army etc was not listened to.

He's mad, because he was told that he was wrong, so he of course is going to say that the administration that DISAGREED with him was wrong.

Well, sorry, the administration is NOT wrong.

The Iraq war was NOT about 911, it was about fighting terrorists, and cutting off their money, their weapons, and make damned sure that they didn't get ANY WMD's that Saddam might have had, or could have given them.

Once we had a 911, the administration decided that we were NOT going to have another one, and wow, we haven't...

What a bizarre concept.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

quote:

Originally posted by nomad:

Why should you have another 911 ? Terrorists don't even need to travel to the US anymore to kill americans. More than 1700 servicemen to date. At the current rate, the number of fallen soldiers & US civilian contractors will equate 911 in less than two years.

Yes indeed, and HOW many terrorists have died Nomad? How many TERRORISTS that were a clear and present danager to the United States have died Nomad? How many training camps have been destroyed, how much money has been cut off, how many INNOCENT American civilians have been saved because of the sacrifice of the 1700+ fine american SOLDIERS?

HMMM? I bet you don't think about that, do you Nomad...

Here's a $20, go buy a clue!! PLEASE!!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

quote:

Anyhow, I guess if you were right, the Army would'n have the recruitment problems they are facing. Seems that youngs get a big problem with this perception that it is OK to indefinitely put soldier's lives at risk abroad with no tangible result on the field.

Your right on the money here too, Nomad.

I had a Navy recruiting officer pull up beside me, while I was out for a walk yesterday. He rolled his window down, while keeping pace with me, as I was walking.

" Sir, has anyone talked to you about the Navy?", he asked me.

I stopped and started laughing. I ask that Idiot, "Are they really so hard up? I am nearing 50, and have already done my 6 yrs... OVER 20 years ago!!"

He tried to re-word his spiel, so I had to tell that dumb jerk to get the h*ll away from me, before I lost my temper.( I cant stand people who run their mouths, and don't have sense enough to hear a response )

I cannot hardly believe he could not recognize my age, as I do have LOTS of gray hair. I did hear rumor they raised the cut-off age from 33 to something else, but never bothered to verify it.

Instigation of the "Draft", I see, as not too far from becoming a necessity. You cannot keep the kids caught up in a "Patriotic Lynch Mob Mentality" indefinitely. The momentum is beginning to die off(THANK GOD)

I firmly get the impression, they are beginning to get desperate. then again.... I could just blow it off and say. "Damn I look good, for my age!!"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, I saw a report a week or two ago on CBS that it's mostly the parents who are discouraging their kids from joining up and going with them to the recruitment offices. These paremts have finally realized that the military is no longer the Welfare department and Baby Sitting service it once was where one got free college education and benefits etc... The military is serious business. In this day and age, you need to give something back for a change and that is actual service.

BTW: I do believe that the recruitment age has been increased to 39 for the army reserve. The military finally began to realize that they were turning away mature and valuable assets that wanted to join up but couldn't because of their age and who knew what they were actually going in for.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I see your point lost...but lets take this one step further.

There is a VERY disturbing social divide, created because of bush and the way he has handled EVERYTHING.

One CANNOT discount the legitimate GRASS ROOTS reactions to this whole affair.

for example: When I recieve a letter from one of the most Patriotic and FREEDOM fighting AMERICANS, I have ever met, like the one I received today!!

quote:

Dear Jeffey,

Any Donation today, will be matched dollar for dollar by an anonymous donor.

Please help!

Your help is needed more urgently than ever.

In its 40-odd years speaking truth to power, Amnesty International has incurred the wrath of many despotic governments -- whose human rights violations, political prisoners and other abuses came to light through Amnesty's painstaking field research.

But few assaults by governments have been more disturbing than Washington's attacks on our recent Annual Report findings about widespread use of torture and cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment by U.S. troops and federal officers. This reaction is especially troubling considering our nation's long-standing history as a champion of human rights.

Recent revelations of abuse by our own government of detainees in Iraq and Guantanamo are simply shocking.

They violate bedrock American values.

They violate the Geneva Convention.

These actions are destroying U.S. credibility in the world.

When the United States helped draft the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, the U.S. was a beacon of hope and justice for millions struggling against tyranny. Our leadership - in word and deed - is no less important today.

Amnesty is in the final stages of launching one of the most ambitious mass mobilizations in our history - to demand, as American citizens, an end to torture and cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment by our own government.

This mobilization is taxing our already stretched resources. Please consider making a substantial donation right now using our secure Web page.

Thanks to generous anonymous donors, all gifts to this emergency mobilization will be matched dollar-for-dollar.

The facts are ugly. Witnesses to abuse of detainees in Iraq and Guantanamo report hooding, beatings, placement of lit cigarettes into prisoners' ear canals, and sleep deprivation. Amnesty has compiled a list of 60 techniques authorized or used by the U.S. during the "war on terror."

Eyewitness reports from FBI agents read like the stuff of horror films. One agent described coming into an

"unventilated room probably well over 100 degrees. The detainee was almost unconscious on the floor, with a pile of hair next to him. He had apparently been literally pulling his own hair out throughout the night."

And these are not the acts of a few bad apples, as U.S. officials have claimed. Evidence is mounting that officials at the highest level of the U.S. government approved brutal interrogation techniques.

Under the Geneva Convention and the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, torture and cruel inhuman and degrading treatment is NEVER permissible. We need to send the Administration an unmistakable message - that Americans did not give the government a mandate last November to violate international law by engaging in acts of barbarism. Nobody voted for that.

Amnesty USA is determined to mobilize a vocal, diverse and massive constituency throughout this country that will stand with our 320,000-strong U.S. membership in demanding an end to the use of torture by all agencies at all levels of government in the United States.

Thanks to years of grassroots activism, Amnesty has a corps of volunteers ready to carry out this urgently needed mobilization And it's the most motivated and inspired citizen force you could hope to find.

But mobilizing people also takes money. And that's why I'm asking you for your help. Please donate now using our secure Web page and have your gift matched dollar-for-dollar through June 30th.

If we're to rescue our country from the taint of being branded a practitioner of torture, then we must confront the Bush Administration head-on with this issue. With your help, I believe justice will prevail.

Thanks for all your help.

Sincerely,

Bill Schulz

Amnesty International USA

I'm not near as RADICAL, nor ALONE, as some may believe.

The GOVERNMENT is SINKING, in it's own deceptions, and those willingly ignoring the ALARMS, deserves to see fruit of their labor...right or wrong!!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I seldom double post, but i feel this is a necessary addendum.

Then, I pull the following letter from my desk, and wonder..."How in the H*ll, ANYONE can continue to ignore the REALITY of events, this country has entagled itself, and to the sanity of those who do so."

quote:

June 20, 2005

The Honorable George W. Bush

President of the United States

The White House

Washington, DC 20500

Dear Mr. President:

I write to bring your attention to the letter sent by William F. Schulz, Executive Director of Amnesty International USA to you on June 21, 2005 regarding your meeting with Prime Minister Phan Van Khai of Vietnam. The letter summarizes key human rights concerns and asks you to seek commitments from the Prime Minister to release all prisoners of conscience and to make sustained and systematic improvements in human rights conditions in Vietnam. The letter urges you to press the Prime Minister to lift restrictions on freedom of conscience, expression, religion, and association and to end the practice of arbitrary arrest and unfair trials.

As you seek assurances for the release of all prisoners of conscience, we urge you specifically to raise the case of the Venerable Thich Huyen Quang, the 86-year-old Supreme Patriarch of the Unified Buddhist Church of Vietnam (UBCV). The Venerable Thich Huyen Quanghas spent most of the last 28 years imprisoned or under house arrest for his peaceful advocacy of religious freedom and human rights. As you know, the Unified Buddhist Church of Viet Nam was formed in 1951 and was banned by the government in 1981, but many members of the church both in Vietnam and overseas continued to follow the teachings of its monks. Attempts by the Vietnamese government to control all religious institutions in the country have not deterred the UBCV followers from practicing their religion.

In the last several months we welcomed the release of Father Thadeus Nguyen Ly and Dr. Nguyen Que. We hope to be able to welcome the release of The Venerable Thich Huyen Quang and other prisoners of conscience who languish incarcerated in Vietnam. Thank you for your assistance.

Sincerely,

Alexandra Arriaga

Associate Deputy Executive Director and

Director of Government Relations

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The Army is 8000 recruits short this year from their goal.

Oh no, NOT 8000, out of how many?

Recruitment is only down because parents are afraid for their little boys and girls, when in fact, you are more likely to get killed in a car accident, then you are getting killed in the military.

TINSTAFL, there is no such thing as a free lunch, and people are beginning to realize exactly what LIS said.

Yeah, the military maybe a LITTLE below recruitment levels, but the people that ARE there, want to be there.

Quality, or quantity?

I will take quality EVERY time...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Whats sad, is that jaguar is diffenantly RIGHT

Look at me, I joined the army out of my own free will, my father wasn't exactly liking the idea but he still supported me

Why are army numbers low? Well let see

1. Parents are to afraid of lossing there son/daughter

2. Certain events in Fort Knox

3. Lieing recruiters or recruiters who are falsifing records (and have thus been caught, which sent a bad rep to the people)

So in all, you have a higher chance of death while in the civvy life than you do in the military life

Like.. oh lets see? There are over 100,000+ civilan deaths a month, while there are fewer than 100-200 deaths military related a month

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just to add to my fleetmates point, here is some data.

297 million US citizens (as of 2004 US census bureau). Less than .01% die per month ~200k.

US military has ~1.5m soldiers (all branches). Deaths in 2004 < 2000 = ~.001%.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree, on all your other points, as far as HELPING to deminish the amount of volunteers to military during (so called) war time..... BUT this does NOT negate, the 50 Percent(or so) who stand

firm AGAINST this whole atrocity toward common sense and reason.

And, not trying to be aurgumentive, but comparing the civilian related deaths to the ENTIRE population, against those of the Military related deaths, is really a bit out of proportion....dont you think?

You are forgetting, the REASON, the military DEATHS are so low.....

#1) I doubt the ACTUAL count is anywhere near as low as presented.(Since When, has the U.S. Government or Military EVER told the TRUTH about ANYTHING?) It would be RATIONAL, to assume the numbers released would be reduced, to help eliminate public dessention toward a war, which almost HALF the population is AGAINST.

After all, ANY statistical figure's outcome can be reduced /or inflated..depending on HOW it is compared and How it is Presented.(just like polls...NO different)

You guys are presenting a Perfect Example of this , by comparing the TOTAL population of the U.S. deaths, with that of a TREMENDOUSLY smaller number of Military personel...where only a few hundred thousand are actually stationed within a war zone.

I do NOT say your numbers are WRONG, just that the presentation of those numbers or Pecentiles, does NOT provide an accurate foundation to the perception you present: " your safer within the military, than in civilian life. "

In FACT, if that perception is TRUE, and it does have solid foundation..... Then there is something VERY lopsided, about the nature of our military and it's responsibility to AMERICAN civilians.

#2) (The MOST VIABLE reason.)WE are the MOST powerful MILITARY presence in the WORLD..and we have INVADED an Economic Deprived, 3rd world country, with ancient, left-over Primitive weapons. Who had NO way of resupply or support.

So, I suppose: so FEW Military deaths is something to be REAL PROUD of....ROFLMAO

Link to comment
Share on other sites

quote:

And, not trying to be aurgumentive, but comparing the civilian related deaths to the ENTIRE population, against those of the Military related deaths, is really a bit out of proportion....dont you think?


Quite simply - No. By showing these numbers we accurately show that " your safer within the military, than in civilian life. "

It would be different if we were comparing 2000 deaths to 200 thousand deaths. Then it would be a biased, unresearched, non-representative sample of the death ratio. In fact just by being percentages, which by defination means amount up to 100 - therfore putting both numerical groups on an even keel - shows a conclusive ratio of deaths to sample. Also those numbers show total deaths in the military - NOT just active duty personnel. That includes accidents in Germany, or Nebraska, or anywhere else in the world. Now, does that mean that a single death in either group is "OK"? No, but let's not debate data with rhetoric. This tired tirade of 'Big Brother Government' is always lying to us is getting to be a bit rediculous. Forgive me for being childish, but you do have the right to choose elsewhere to live.

Now, in a way, I can agree with you that statistical data can be miss-represented by taking specific values from one group and comparing to specifics of another. BUT, in this case we are not singling out specifics. This is ALL deaths, accidental, purposefull, or other, for both groups - Military vs US Civilian. By doing thus, we can keep specificity, and data corruption out of the equation. I know this is a reiterization, but it's an important point.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Salutations,

I don't think we should have wasted ONE AMERICAN life in dealing with the bigotted and hate motivated Islamic terrorists and the countries that harbor and nurture them.

Bottom line.... they hate us for our support of Israel and the fact that we and Israelies are NOT ISLAMIC.

In the past they have ganged up on the tiny nation of Israel and gotten their butts handed to them. How could their all powerful Allah have permitted that to happen? Isreals existance is a constant insult to the Islamic world and their beliefs.

How can the non-Islamic Israelies and Americans repeatedly defeat Allah's adherents? This can't be.

If I would have been in charge.. the problem would have been settled in less than 40 minutes.

Our Nukes could have level every Islamic city and military facility in the world. Problem gone. Then we could do something useful work on clearing up the radioacitve fall out.

Extreme? Yes... Effective... no doubt. Will it happen... no.

My assertion isn't based on hate... just an acknowledgement of who and what our Islamic enemies are. One can't coddle a viper... either avoid if or kill it.

We can't avoid Islam. Therefore...

I can anticipate the commnent " but all the innocent "... To hell with them... let their all powerful Allah sort them out.

I guarantee that an Atomic war is in the future. Billions will die. No concession to any Islamic nation or nations will prevent it. Disagree if you want... watch and see. Probably within the next 5-15 years.

Don't bother building a bomb shelter. Take yoga to increase your flexibility, so you can bend over and kiss your arse goodbye.

All in all it's intersting to watch what is going on.

Always remember... opinions are like arse holes... everybody has one, and they all stink.

Including mine.

Have a nice day.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

quote:

This tired tirade of 'Big Brother Government' is always lying to us is getting to be a bit rediculous. Forgive me for being childish, but you do have the right to choose elsewhere to live.

If you could live in RED CHINA or RUSSIA..why dont you?...WHY you people insist on backing a system which DESTROYS freedom at its very base core...and expect US to MOVE??

sorri fella, this is a fight to the death...Im NOT leaving my country ...Im fighting YOU communist loving _____ to the grave!!!!

quote:

Comparing the mortality of 1'500'000 individuals who are considered healthy and mentally sane enough to serve in the armed forces to the mortality of a whole civilian population who includes child mortality, deaths due to diseases, drug addiction and natural deaths due to advanced age is the funniest thing I ever heard. Notice that I did not mention accidents, suicides and crime...

That's Mickey Mouse statistics. Ever heard abour epidemiology ? There's quite a bit of methodology behind it...


AMEN!!

quote:

I guarantee that an Atomic war is in the future. Billions will die. No concession to any Islamic nation or nations will prevent it. Disagree if you want... watch and see. Probably within the next 5-15 years.

Maybe so, but IF that be the case..it will be because TWO or more...EXTREMEs refuse to bend, ever so slightly...

You my friend are ONE of those extremes...no better or worse than ISLAM and their views.

THAT is the problem with the WHOLE (NEO-(NAZI)-CON) self rightous conservative's logic, rationale, and methodology.

I thank YOU sir, and ALL those who agree with you, for our destruction, as a people, in advance!!

Those, who think with OBJECTIVE reason, may save this planet...DISPITE BOTH TERRORIST extremest influence and actions.

We are going to give it our BEST SHOT!!

Deny you stand for terror...and RE-READ your post!!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

(Once again, im double posting, as I dont have time, and feel this is a relevant continuation to that above and i must hurry)

This is VERY relevant to the issue, at hand: Prison Abuse. War on the Terrorist....and especially in regard to the INVASION of IRAQ.(TAKE AND RULE BY FORCE METHODOLOGY)

First, to understand MY views and position, one must have SOME

realization, as to WHAT constitutes a definitive difference

between Communist/marxist ideology and what WE refer to as a

FREE democracy. Just saying it is a democracy...does'nt cut it. Even

OLD communist russia..had Elections...not so different from our own.

" FREE DEMOCRACY " is the relevant term...and dont feed me that

crap about being a FEDERAL REPUBLIC.

"NOT WHAT THEY taught my generation; nor ANY generation before me."

That was merely descriptive terminology... not a JUSTIFICATION to eliminate

the FREE DEMOCRATIC CONCEPTS being stomped on today by BUSH and

his NEO-CON following.

Something, I would like to see differentiated in writing from YOU.

As I have placed my fundamental perspective on the table concerning

the two quite consistently. Usually the neocon response has some

reference to emotional rhetoric, rather than an intelligent base.

Second, most who stand behind THE BUSH family's Marxist ideology,

base their basic understanding on the information released by

the BUSH administration's P.R. releases, with JUSTIFICATIONS.... rather than

rational and objective observation of events and information available; as to

truth, in their actions;truth, in their purpose; and especially truth,

in their actual results.

third: SINCE the 1st bush administration, the republican party has

tried to push thousands of bills through(some of which this administration

has successfully accomplished) which ARE IDENTICAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

to bills introduced in PRE-WW2 Germany, following Hitler winning his

ELECTED position.

End Result in hitlers successful campaign?....WE ALL KNOW.

Now, WHY in GODS HOLY NAME, would you back the IDENTICAL path,

which caused germany's demise....AND WHY CANT YOU SEE IT???????

I have read MANY theories, but no single theory seems to account

for the COMPLETE and TOTAL acceptance of explainations which

totally DEFY basic intelligence and logic.

Im outta here, got to get ready for my flight to Georgia tomorrow.

be back when Im back

Link to comment
Share on other sites

quote:

If you could live in RED CHINA or RUSSIA..why dont you?...WHY you people insist on backing a system which DESTROYS freedom at its very base core...and expect US to MOVE??

sorri fella, this is a fight to the death...Im NOT leaving my country ...Im fighting YOU communist loving _____ to the grave!!!!

Do you have any clue as to what you are talking about? I was argueing data as a way of supporting the US military - which I happen to be a veteran, and I'm a Republican. These things do not make a communist. It's obvious you are fighting some imaginary foe that only lives on 3000ad forums and rears it's ugly head to confuse the issue with " Im fighting YOU communist loving _____ to the grave!!!!" rhetoric. Nice. Let me know when you want to present some supporting evidence to the contrary - and no, capitalization of specific WORDS does NOT make them more true.

As to the rest of the tripe...not really worth my time. Everyone quotes something about Hitler. Try being original. I promise, it only hurts for a bit.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You know street, every time I read one of your posts, I run across neo-con/neo-nazi inferences. Do you think this makes you sound more credible? I find it ridiculous myself. Your basically saying that if you have an opposing viewpoint from the all-knowing, all-seeing "Street", then you get lumped in with a group that feel it was okay to exterminate 6 million innocent Jews AND would like to see all foreigners exterminated so that the White race can be the all-powerful group it deserves to be.

Imo, you must be pretty insecure to post like this EVERY time. Your facts are not facts; they are unsubstantiated conjecture, and as such are easily refuted. However, it is simply not worth the time debating someone who throws around the term Neo-nazi as if it was a synonym with conservative. You may be "almost 50" but perhaps your debating skills still need some maturing...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now
 Share


×
×
  • Create New...