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The State of Our Educational System


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My 15 Year old son called me from school the day before yesterday, apparently they put him in "Remedial Language Arts" because they showed on his record that he had failed the FCATs. When he explained to the teacher that they made a mistake, he looked up his record on the computer, realized he was supposed to be in advanced placement, he then told him it would take 2 weeks for them to transfer him. That's when he decided to call me because he says he couldn't take 2 weeks of that class. I went to the school and had him changed over immediately. I met with his new teacher to ask what the curriculum is like, and he assured me that they would be doing everything possible to prepare the students for college. He also gave me an outline of the material they would be going over for the entire sememster.

When my son got home from school, he told me that the teacher at the remedial class, immediately started making fun of all the students there, his first words were "So is everyone here ready to flip burgers for the rest of their lives?" Then went on to say demoralizing things like, "Even though you kids won't be going to college, and probably won't graduate, you're still stuck here - at least until you're 16 and can choose to leave". It seems to me that life is about expectations, it's no wonder that these kids that end up in remedial education never get caught up, they're expected to fail and no one even makes an attempt to rectify the situation. This is the reason why we need to privatise the school system, these teachers have ABSOLUTLY NO incentive to help these kids out and move them to the next level.

My son tells me that in 1 day of being in the AP Class, he's gone over more material than the first 4 days in the remedial class.

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quote:

Originally posted by Darkling:

My 15 Year old son called me from school the day before yesterday, apparently they put him in "Remedial Language Arts" because they showed on his record that he had failed the FCATs. When he explained to the teacher that they made a mistake, he looked up his record on the computer, realized he was supposed to be in advanced placement, he then told him it would take 2 weeks for them to transfer him. That's when he decided to call me because he says he couldn't take 2 weeks of that class. I went to the school and had him changed over immediately. I met with his new teacher to ask what the curriculum is like, and he assured me that they would be doing everything possible to prepare the students for college. He also gave me an outline of the material they would be going over for the entire sememster.

When my son got home from school, he told me that the teacher at the remedial class, immediately started making fun of all the students there, his first words were "So is everyone here ready to flip burgers for the rest of their lives?" Then went on to say demoralizing things like, "Even though you kids won't be going to college, and probably won't graduate, you're still stuck here - at least until you're 16 and can choose to leave". It seems to me that life is about expectations, it's no wonder that these kids that end up in remedial education never get caught up, they're expected to fail and no one even makes an attempt to rectify the situation. This is the reason why we need to privatise the school system, these teachers have ABSOLUTLY NO incentive to help these kids out and move them to the next level.

My son tells me that in 1 day of being in the AP Class, he's gone over more material than the first 4 days in the remedial class.

I am unsurprised...

This is another reason that I homeschool.

The public school system is indoctrination, NOT education, the teachers could care less about the kids, they have a curicullum to teach, and then move them on. Just a babysitter that throws them books and 2 hours of homework a night.

I won't put my children through such nonsense.

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quote:

Originally posted by Jaguar:

This is another reason that I homeschool.


I wish I could homeschool, that's just not an option for me, I had them in private school before me and my first wife got divorced, but after the divorce, I couldn't afford it anymore, and now that I could, the kids don't want to go back (friends and all that) and their mother sides with them on that issue.

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I'm torn on the issue... depending on where you live - public schooling can be a good option. In Birmingham for example, two of our school districts are extremely well ranked nationally - one is even listed in Forbes as one of the top nation's schools in reading.

In the poorer neighborhoods however - the schools are generally of much lower quality. Partially because of being government run, but partially because of the behavior of the students.

On homeschooling, this is definitely a good option for those who are intelligent enough to make sure their kids know everything that they need to know in life. But even if you public school, there are some things you could do in order to prepare your child for the real world that schools do not do. This is where being a parent comes in.

Teach your child all about balancing a checkbook, debt, credit, and the way the economy works. Teach your child the fundamentals of business and career building. If your child says they want to be something - point them in the right direction and encourage them. Supplement where the school system fails. Go to PTA meetings. Involve yourself.

Turning your child over to the government and then turning a blind eye is child abuse.

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quote:

Originally posted by JUDGExKTF:

quote:

Originally posted by Jaguar:

This is another reason that I homeschool.

The public school system is indoctrination, NOT education

I won't put my children through such nonsense.

While homeschooling can be a good thing for a lot of people who know how to raise their kids, it can wreak havoc on the kids of those who don't.

I recently saw a documentary on those two racist twins ( http://abcnews.go.com/Primetime/story?id=1231684&page=1 ). Because they've never gone to a public school they only know about the world what their parents tell them (which is, well, rather biased). To them their racist thoughts are perfectly normal, because the dont have a frame of reference. If they would go to a public school everyday they would notice soon enough that something is off and start to ask questions.

In Holland home teaching is forbidden and childeren must attend a public school from 5 till 18. So education in Holland is not a right, but an obligation.

So in my opinion public schools are a good thing.

And if something goes wrong; Thats a good taste of what life is going to be like after school. Welcome to the real world


Most of the people that homeschool care about their kids well being, and do NOT do such nonsense as the parents of those twins.

When you throw a .001% example out there to attempt to show that homeschooling is somehow bad, well, it's ridiculous.

My children are so far beyond their publicly schooled age groups that it is insane.

We also have MANY different activities for them, that include many of their homeschooled friends, as well as their publicly schooled friends.

I find the whole idea that homeschooling is bad for children as insane.

I won't send my child to a fortress for 8 hours a day, 5 days a week.

Zero tolerance, is ZERO common sense, drugs, peer pressure, security guards, no cell phones, lock downs, etc, etc.

STUPID in the extreme, I will not put my children through such nonsense. 3 hours of homework a night, make work that they could easily learn without all the BS crap.

Kids are kids, and should be allowed to be kids, overloading them with 20 pound bookbags, sending them home with 3 hours homework every night, and making them miniadults is insane, and just outright cruel as far as I am concerned.

Public schools are NO longer TEACHING children TO think, they are indoctrinating children on WHAT to think.

Huge difference between the 2.

I won't do it to my kids....

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I agree that a mandatory, QUALITY education is essential.

Therefore, I can understand why Jaguar keeps his kids at home. Public schooling has become a sham of indoctrination and focus on so-called "wellness". With public schooling, education is fast becoming second to self-esteem. Sure, while it is, to a degree, important that the child has a positive self-image, the image that OTHERS have of said child will be what dictates his/her success later in life. Education goes a long way in projection this image.

If school is about a child's future, it should focus on preparing children for what is to come - not coddling them. Until the public school system learns this, other alternatives should be explored.

As for my children ... private school.

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quote:

Originally posted by JUDGExKTF:

I recently saw a documentary on those two racist twins (
). Because they've never gone to a public school they only know about the world what their parents tell them (which is, well, rather biased). To them their racist thoughts are perfectly normal,...

In Holland home teaching is forbidden and childeren must attend a public school from 5 till 18. So education in Holland is not a right, but an obligation.

So in my opinion public schools are a good thing....

Tell that to Bridget Green, New Orleans High School Valedictorian in 2003. She couldn't even pass the Luisianna Graduation Exam, (Well she did by 1 point after 3 attempts.) But hey, she was Valedictrian right!

I think you will find that for every one negative story on Home Schooling, there are 100 Negative stories on our public school system. Until the system is privatized, so the money follows the student, you won't see any REAL improvements in the system. I've been hearing my ENTIRE LIFE, how they (the school system) is concerned and how privatizing the system would only sap resources from them, but yet here we are in the new millenium, and they've not only done nothing about the problems, instead they've gotten MORE political, MORE entrenched and students grades in almost every area has done nothing but gotten worse. The only thing our public school system is good for is advancing liberal democrats careers.

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and they've not only done nothing about the problems, instead they've gotten MORE political, MORE entrenched and students grades in almost every area has done nothing but gotten worse. The only thing our public school system is good for is advancing liberal democrats careers.

The moment that stupid "No Child Shall Be Left Behind" bull crap was passed our school system was FINISHED!

School's can't expel a student, because then they won't get an education.

Teachers are baddly underpaid, I still think they should all strke at once and show the government just how they feel.

Our school's are over crowded because of the NCSBL, they can't handle such an influx of students, and further more, how do they expect teachers to teach when they have classes with 40-50-60 students and just THEM?

My old elementary school here used to be a very fine place to go to, but now it's so baddly over-crowded that they have portables EVERYWHERE on the campus, including in the soccer fields and play grounds, where the students can no longer have any fun during recess.

If they want to improve the school system, then get RID of the No Child Shall Be Left Behind crap and DEPORT every ILLLEGAL CHILD from the school system back to there country!

The only children here who deserve an education are LEGAL CHILDREN, born from LEGAL PARENTS

(another reason why I think you should NOT be granted automatic citizenship to a new born until a few year's passes. Like in Japan, where you have to wait a certain number of years before you can apply for citizenship, and yes you have to take a test last I checked.)

Until that happens, we will continue to graduate idiots from high schools who can't READ, WRITE or do MATH. Or even worse - who can't speak ENGLISH when it's the international TRADE language.

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Teachers are baddly underpaid, I still think they should all strke at once and show the government just how they feel.

That's an old argument that even teachers don't use anymore.

Heh, in Wisconsin there's a HUGE debate raging about how OVER-compensated teachers are.

They work roughly ten months out of the year, are BONUSED on anything over nine and 1/2 months, have COMPLETELY FREE healthcare (that's right, NO premiums), and, upon reaching retirement, will have over $1 MILLION in PENSION BENEFITS (yup ... they don't have to save for themselves).

On the contrary, a NORMAL, educated worker doing a service for society has to PAY for health insurance, save for their OWN retirement, work on average 11 months each year, etc.

Oh, and here's the BIG thing: if they don't do a good job, they can LOSE their job fairly easily (also unlike a teacher).

Also, think of the BILLIONS of dollars that pay for the pensions of retirees... all that money is NOT going to students. All that, just because teachers can't be bothered to use a 401K like most of the rest of us.

All that plus a starting salary of $36K (for not even a YEAR'S work) can hardly be called "underpaid".

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Public School - Bad.

Home School - Bad.

Why? Because they both are indoctrination. In public school you are being offered state-approved indoctrination, and in home schools you are being offered parents-approved indoctrination(which can actually be a lot worse than the state-approved in reality-wise).

Let them indoctrinate you I say. Bigger the lie, harder they fall. By this I mean that when someone grows up and begins to realise that he have been brainwashed(=lied to) all along, more he will lose faith in dominant system.

-v

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quote:


Originally posted by Voli0:

Public School - Bad.

Home School - Bad.

Why? Because they both are indoctrination. In public school you are being offered state-approved indoctrination, and in home schools you are being offered parents-approved indoctrination(which can actually be a lot worse than the state-approved in reality-wise).

Let them indoctrinate you I say. Bigger the lie, harder they fall. By this I mean that when someone grows up and begins to realise that he have been brainwashed(=lied to) all along, more he will lose faith in dominant system.

-v


VERY good "outside-the-box" post! Very succint in pointing out the issues, and I do agree with you.

Now, however, what's the solution?

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quote:

Originally posted by Wolferz:

Public schools: The Maytag of brainwashing.

Now, if we could just teach Darkling how to spell
L O U I S I A N N A

You got me, that's what I get for not using my Spell Checker.

quote:

Originally posted by Kalshion:

The moment that stupid "No Child Shall Be Left Behind" bull crap was passed our school system was FINISHED!

PLEASE!!! Are you saying the system was FINE before that bill was passed!?!?!

quote:

Originally posted by Kalshion:

School's can't expel a student, because then they won't get an education.

But they WILL expel a student for violating the dress code, they already have TOO many ways to expel students, they don't need anymore.

quote:

Originally posted by Kalshion:

Teachers are baddly underpaid, I still think they should all strke at once and show the government just how they feel.

When my son was in Private School, his teacher was telling me how her daughter went to college completely free because she was going to be a teacher for the public school system. Once she got the job, it was a fairly low paying job, but keep in mind she got her education for free. By the time her daughter had 5 years of seniority, she was making more than she was, plus she used all the down time in the job to get her Masters Degree, (for free). She told me that in another couple of months when she got her Masters Degree, she would end up making 50% more than she was making.

While it's true that the average teacher in Florida makes less than the average teacher in the NE, the cost of living is lower here, so it balances out, but how do you explain the fact that the Catholic School system, is giving kids a superior education, while paying their teachers a bit less on average, AND with less benefits, than their Public School counterparts?

As for trying to make this an issue of Illegals, let's face it, the public school system STILL gets paid for EVERY Single kid in the system, and if these "Illegals" can be defined as "Special Needs" they usually get DOUBLE the funding for that child, so believe me when I tell you THAT is not the issue, MONEY is not the issue. Korea is turning out top notch students spedning paltry amounts compared to us. I see schools filled with Portables, and yet at the same time, those portables are filled with Computers. When I went to school they taught me Basic & Pascal Programming, but no one uses those languages any more so it's a waste, what schools need to do is first and formost be PRIVATIZED, anyone that says it's a mistake, take a look at our college system, it's the BEST in the world, why because there are private institutions competing with the public sector, and that makes BOTH better. Second, schools need to teach the basics, English, Reading, Math, Science, get rid of all these extra classes like "Critical Thinking" and "Consumer Math". These are BS classes, why are we wasting Tax Dollars on them?

You act as if before NCLB the schools were perfect, yet they were far from it, there's a basic problem with the schools, and until that basic problem is fixed Nothing will change.

[ 08-23-2006, 09:11 AM: Message edited by: Darkling ]

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The one thing that could be taught in school that isn't is "Life skills"

It amazes me the number of kids coming out of high school that don't know how to write a check or balance a check book.

But let's make danged sure that they know how to conjugate a verb.

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