It's not HIS fault.....

[CommanderJohnson]

Ok. Why is it that so many groups preach the idea that it's never a PERSON's fault something bad happens, but some other influence. I guess the best way to explain it is with examples that may be commonly heard in the media or seen in society. Why is it that some idiotic groups take the position of.....

Guns:

Guns are bad because they can kill people and there is no need to own them. Need safety locks, waiting periods, etc.

INSTEAD OF

People should be trained in safe gun usage and people who kill people are bad and should be locked up.

Cars:

Cars need better safety mechanisms in the event of a crash.

INSTEAD OF

People need to be better drivers.

Taxes/Wealth:

Society/Government needs to help those people who make less money than the average, since society put those people where they are.

INSTEAD OF

People need to work hard to achieve what they want in life, and if they don't they will stay where they are (socio-economic status)

Crime/School Shootings/Murder:

You cant blame them for doing what they do, since they are picked on/without money/in a lower income area/live in inner city. They had good reasons, even if they were bad and the results were horrible. (then the criminals get sympathy or out on parole in a few years)

INSTEAD OF

They are evil and should be locked away. There actually IS evil in the world, and there's the personification of it. You took someone's life, now your going to be locked up for the rest of yours. It was YOUR choice to pull the trigger/rape the woman/steal the car, now your going to have to deal with the consequences of YOUR choice.

I don't know, it's more of an intangible discussion than most, but what do you think about it? It seems to me, that the outspoken parts of society seem to have the idea that we need to find a SOLUTION to a problem (punishment, safety regulations, gun control measures), instead of actually fixing the problem (teaching some sort of morality (yes, i know that morality is based on religion, but so is the constitution, our law, and our society), teaching people how to drive, teaching people how to use guns) I seem to be one of the few people that believe that PEOPLE are resposible for their own actions, and to solve problems you need to change PEOPLE, and not establish regulations and exterior phenomenon (laws, seat belts, safety locks, etc anything NOT directly related to a person's inner thought/upbringing), to try to "fix" problems. This is probably going to start a huge argument, but please lets ***NOT GET INTO ARGUMENTS OVER MY EXAMPLES***. Lets keep this **ON TOPIC*, aka, we discuss the *UNDERLYING MESSAGE* and not just *Gun control good/bad, law good/bad, safety regulations good/bad*

I guess one question to sum up everytihng would be:

Why doesn't anyone realize that people are the real problem?

[XenoZohar]

I think most know that people are the problem. None want to do anything about it because nobody enjoys being labeled a problem. Would you want someone to try to "fix" you? (pardon the pun) That feeling is the "problem" with people. Most don't want anyone to try to "fix" them. They want to "fix" themselves, they don't care, or they don't understand their own problems. In the end, someone brings in a scapegoat and the cycle continues. Sucks, but not something that is easily rectified in a population of millions of people, all with different beliefs and values. That's another thing: No one likes having values forced on him or her. Would you want someone keeping you from accessing the Internet because they thought it's an evil, pr0n-filled realm of anonymity and chaos?

Er, rambling...must sleep. Night all.

[Guest $iLk]

That's all it is, scapegoating an inanimate object for a person's actions/failure to act.

[hyndis]

This is how a trial goes these days. For lack of a better name, I'll just use OBL...

OBL: Yes, there are pictures of me firing heavy weapons into that kindergarden, and yes, there's video of me raping and killing dozens of women, girls, and animals, and yes, I confess to everything! And I was proud of it!

OBL Lawyer: Objection! He was the under influence of the insane terrorist organization at the time! These actions were not his fault.

Judge: Very well, this court finds the insane terrorist organization to be guilty of all these crimes. The defendant is free to go.

OBL: [Goes outside, is mowed down by dozens of snipers on nearby buildings, flogged, set on fire, and dragged through the streets of New York.]

It seems nothing is ever anybody's own dumb fault. The insane people at Columbine didn't do it, playing Doom caused them to be evil murderers. Its not the bank robber's fault, its the drug cartels that caused him to become addicted and created his need for money. Its not the stupid woman's fault for spilling hot coffee on her lap, its McDonald's for not somehow warning her that coffee is indeed hot.

There's this great page of actual product warnings, running all the way from totally absurd to utterly bizzare, and remember, each of these warnings was created because someone was stupid enough to do that!

"Recycled flush water unsafe for drinking." -- On a toilet at a public sports facility in Ann Arbor, Michigan.

"This product not intended for use as a dental drill." -- On an electric rotary tool.

"May irritate eyes." -- On a can of self-defense pepper spray.

"Eating rocks may lead to broken teeth." -- On a novelty rock garden set called "Popcorn Rock."

"Caution: Hot beverages are hot!" -- On a coffee cup.

"Warning: has been found to cause cancer in laboratory mice." -- On a box of rat poison.

"Warning: do not use if you have prostate problems." -- On a box of Midol PMS relief tablets.

"Product will be hot after heating." -- On a supermarket dessert box.

"Not for human consumption." -- On a package of dice.

"Do not attempt to stop the blade with your hand." -- In the manual for a Swedish chainsaw.

"Warning: May cause drowsiness." -- On a bottle of Nytol, a brand of sleeping pills.

"Warning: Misuse may cause injury or death." -- Stamped on the metal barrel of a .22 calibre rifle.

Now, of course it was all the product's fault. It was the chainsaw's fault for cutting off the guy's hand, it was the coffee's fault for spilling on the woman's lap...

Do we really need all this?

Why can't we just get rid of all these absurd warnings and protections, and just let Darwinism clean all of the skum out of the gene pool? And yes, I mean that. If you're so fricking stupid you dont know that you're not supposed to grab the blade of a chainsaw while its running, then you dont deserve to have that hand.

The same is true for criminal cases, but in those cases, its more tragic than funny.

Okay...so some derranged person uses an illigally obtained weapon in a violent crime. Do you fix that by passing laws against guns, or by sending that person to the chair?

Just because an insane person feels like shooting up a whole bunch of people doesn't mean that I will not be breaking the law by purchasing, or simply keeping the weapon I already have.

[CommanderJohnson]

Great post Fox, makes perfect sense. They should get rid of a lot (not all, but a lot) of the stupid causalities, etc, to get out of being punished in the legal system. A jury should determine whether or not someone is fit to stand trial, if they are mentally incompetant, etc. Watch the movie "15 minutes", I know that the system isn't bad to THAT extent, but there are a lot of ways that people can get off with very little punishment.

[hyndis]

Thanks.

I accidentially clicked on a banner ad for EQ. I felt the need to rant for some reason...

Actually, I think I'm the reason why they let the Iron Curtain drop over the EQ message boards. I caught Abashi in the act. He was swearing and cursing at this one person...though the message was quickly edited out of existance, I managed to be there are just the right time...

EQ is evil.

[aramike]

Good topic!