Tax Man Commeth

[LostInSpace]

NY Daily News: A kick in the ash

I wish these news people would give a complete story. Like not only talk about the rough tactics NY city is now using to collect tax in cigs but also include the items about what they are actually doing with that money. Like spanking new

golf courses upstate etc....

"The tax was increased because we wanted to keep young people from starting to smoke,"

Fine and dandy so just charge the young people the tax not an adult who chooses and wishes to smoke.

This cig tax is just an excuse to milk this cash cow they've started. If anyone believes it's because of the above reasons or health I've got a bridge to sell ya.

[jamotto]

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Originally posted by LostInSpace:

Fine and dandy so just charge the young people the tax not an adult who chooses and wishes to smoke.

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I wish it was that simple.

[TARWMSRK]

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This cig tax is just an excuse to milk this cash cow they've started. If anyone believes it's because of the above reasons or health I've got a bridge to sell ya.

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Hey if it wasnt for that excuse then you or someone else would be complaining about whatever other excuse they would use.

Its bad for your health anyway...I mean, either you can have a nice golf course to play on OR you can pay someone to clean up a few hundred cig butts all over the place.

[LostInSpace]

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Originally posted by Carl Burning:

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1: This cig tax is just an excuse to milk this cash cow they've started. If anyone believes it's because of the above reasons or health I've got a bridge to sell ya.

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Hey if it wasnt for that excuse then you or someone else would be complaining about whatever other excuse they would use.

2: Its bad for your health anyway...

3: I mean, either you can have a nice golf course to play on OR you can pay someone to clean up a few hundred cig butts all over the place.

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1: When they said the money was suppose to go to the healthcare system, I didn't mind that much. Sure I grumbled but it was going for a good thing. They turned around and are using that money for their pet projects that I object to. To me that is no better than some organization taking donations claiming it's for the Tsunami relief and then turning around and using that money for everything but that.

2: So maybe it is but that's my problem not your's or every Tom, Dick or Harry. And don't hand the stuff about the second hand smoke. Have you actually read the EPA study on that?

3: I don't play golf nor am I enclined to ever play it. As for cleaning up butts that's the least of anyones worry. Have you seen city streets? The garbage out number the people and it ain't cigarette butts.

[LostInSpace]

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Originally posted by LostInSpace:

3: I don't play golf nor am I enclined

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Correction, enclined should be inclined.

[Guest]

The World Health Organization put out a study about second hand smoke, and stated that there was NO proof that second hand smoke was a danger to ANYONE... Besides those with certain types of allergies.

It is another political scare tactic so that they can go after the smokers, the tobacco companies, and anyone else they feel that has a little spare cash laying about that they can get their greedy, filthy little hands on...

[LostInSpace]

You better fear the tax man cause he ain't gunna stop at cigs: ZDnet: Ohio, New York to VoIP users: we wanna tax you, sucker!!

Nomad, it was just that report NY City used to ban smokers from almost every place but the streets and their homes (and that's been discussed about doing also). That's why I still make use of it. If it's good enough for the city government to still use it in 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004 and they still stand by it in 2005, it's good enough for me to hit them back with it.

[LostInSpace]

Junk-Science: Statement in Response to Judge Osteen's Ruling in the EPA Lawsuit

Tobacco..org: A Federal Court has ruled that the EPA wrongly classified secondhand smoke as a Group A (known human) carcinogen

Jaguar, it's funny that alot of anti groups use the WHO report also (along with the EPA one) to support their stance on smoking bans but meanwhile in the actuall report itself is this line "Conclusion: Our results indicate no association between childhood exposure to ETS and lung cancer."

But in a press release from the WHO march 9th, 1998 "Passive smoking does cause lung cancer, don't let them fool you"

[jamotto]

The Facts About Second Hand Smoke

(Finally)

Website that tries to debunk SHS.

[Darkling]

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Originally posted by Carl Burning:

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This cig tax is just an excuse to milk this cash cow they've started. If anyone believes it's because of the above reasons or health I've got a bridge to sell ya.

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Hey if it wasnt for that excuse then you or someone else would be complaining about whatever other excuse they would use.

Its bad for your health anyway...I mean, either you can have a nice golf course to play on OR you can pay someone to clean up a few hundred cig butts all over the place.

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Yeah but this is BIG TIME abuse by the Government, if I was a smoker in NY, I would sue the government using their own "Usery" Laws agaist them.

[Darkling]

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Originally posted by LostInSpace:

You better fear the tax man cause he ain't gunna stop at cigs:

ZDnet: Ohio, New York to VoIP users: we wanna tax you, sucker!!

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Well I hope they don't use the same tactics that they did with smokers, I have a Vonage Phone here in FL and I also have a NY phone number so my family there can call me with no long distance charges, hopefully NY officials won't be knocking at my door asking for money.

[LostInSpace]

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Credit Card Warning

A strong rumor circulating is that the U.S. State Attorneys General are going to threaten the credit card industry with a class action lawsuit to force them to monitor credit card purchases of tobacco products.

In the case of overseas vendors and the reservation shops (remember, also considered another nation) they cannot force an out of country vendor to come to the U.S. to be prosecuted for selling untaxed tobacco products in the states so they're looking to go after the buyers instead.

(Read an interesting short piece on how Indian national sovereignty works in regard to taxes and the courts at

http://neovox.cortland.edu/vox/vox_09/vox_09.html

The rumor gets a little murky as far as the non-tribal U.S. retailers go. It's reported that they will be forced to sign contracts with UPS, Federal Express and other common carriers that they will not use them to ship tobacco products to anywhere in the U.S. (not just NY as it legally stands now). That would leave only the US Postal Service, unless Congress passes the PACT Act as discussed in the last newsletter that would make shipping illegal, period. The rumor is not clear on whether the credit card companies will be asked to monitor purchases from these sites as well. That's probably been left unclarified because non-tribal-run sites are not shielded from legal action and not immune from legal action that would demand they turn over their customer lists -- the government getting it that way instead of through credit card history. However, it's reasonable to conclude that the AGs could easily ask the credit card companies to monitor them too.

The solution to protecting yourself against this new threat is a MONEY ORDER. Money orders are virtually untraceable and are happily accepted by retailers. As far as tribal-run retailers go, they might record that purchase but since they won't turn over their customer list you're doubly covered.

In a related matter, likely NY's first step in working toward the above, NYS Attorney General Spitzer just recently demanded that the credit card processor, VeriSign, not accept transactions that come from NY cigarette retailers no matter what state the customer resides in. It's not clear that every retailer has been affected. Those that are have sent notices to customers about the situation or posted a notice on their site, claiming that one way they hope to rectify the situation is by finding an alternate processor. However, it appears that in regaining the ability to process credit cards, rectifying the situation only went so far as promising not to process NY customer orders only. They can process credit cards for orders placed by residents of other states.

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CARD FIRMS SMOKED ON 'NET SALES

By Kenneth Lovett

ALBANY ? State Attorney General Eliot Spitzer has turned his attention to Internet cigarette sales by warning credit-card companies to block orders from tax-free online tobacco companies, The Post has learned.

At least two web-based companies, Cigs4free.com and 00Taxfree.com/Indiansmokeshops.com, have told customers that they are presently not shipping to New York.

Cigs4free directly blames Spitzer.

"Our site is temporarily down due to credit-card processor issues," the company says in a recent message posted on its Web site.

"New York State Attorney General Eliot Spitzer has ordered Verisign, our processor, to block any orders from our Web site!"

The Internet company yesterday began accepting phone orders again and said it hopes to begin accepting credit-card orders again as early as today.

Spitzer spokesman Marc Violette denied the AG's office ordered card companies to stop processing orders from online tobacco companies, but acknowledged that "letters of guidance" were sent.

"We're simply reminding credit-card companies and the processors of credit-card transactions that . . . this falls into the category of illegal transactions," Violette said.

It's an understatement to say that New York smokers are under a complete attack. If you don't live in New York, learn and be prepared.

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Be prepared folks smokers are the experiment for the rest of you. Only time will tell then it will be my turn to laugh. Soon my only recourse will be to be a patron of my local drug dealer (and there is plenty). It use to be I'd hear the local dealers mumble this drug and that drug as I walk by but now I hear them say got this cigarette brand or that brand for only $5 which sure as hell beats $7.

[LostInSpace]

And so it begins (sooner than I thought):

SAN FRANCISCO, California (AP) -- City officials are considering a proposal to slap a 17-cent surcharge on paper or plastic shopping bags, a debate sure to be watched as a bellwether for other communities.

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Grocers, bag manufacturers and trade groups say many people already reuse their plastic bags. Other opponents call the plan an unfair and regressive tax on shoppers.

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