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Saddam Captured


LostInSpace
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quote:

Originally posted by Eclipse:

Bout time. Maybe this will help curb a few of the suicide bombers over there.

Ummm, I hate to burst bubbles here but what if it makes it worse with increased attacks with a demand they release Saddam. They should have taken him out but the powers that be consider he's too valuable a source of information. We may find out what countries were secretly dealing and trading with him (among other things). Is this what France and Germany were affraid of? But then again, anything he says can it be believed? I'd like to point out to everyone as to what happened to his statement that he would not be taken alive? He sent thousands of his own people to death in defense of his regime but when it came time for his turn he didn't have the guts. Or was the raid that successful that it totaly caught him off guard. From what I understand, he was captured with a pistol and 750 grand (I'm sure every news channel will have a different figure) and it does seem fiting that he was hiding in a rat hole. And boy will the news be in their glory with something to talk about all day and many days to come oy vey!!

Just a few thoughts for your entertainment .

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Yup..about time, i would really like the peeople coordinating these attacks to have a huge morale drop. They got the head of the beast at last...

And i guess this will help Mr. Tony Blair with his problems, anyways, i have not read the news yet so i'll quit babbling

cheers

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quote:


Originally posted by LostInSpace:

quote:

Originally posted by Eclipse:

Bout time. Maybe this will help curb a few of the suicide bombers over there.


Ummm, I hate to burst bubbles here but what if it makes it worse with increased attacks with a demand they release Saddam. They should have taken him out but the powers that be consider he's too valuable a source of information. We may find out what countries were secretly dealing and trading with him (among other things). Is this what France and Germany were affraid of? But then again, anything he says can it be believed? I'd like to point out to everyone as to what happened to his statement that he would not be taken alive? He sent thousands of his own people to death in defense of his regime but when it came time for his turn he didn't have the guts. Or was the raid that successful that it totaly caught him off guard. From what I understand, he was captured with a pistol and 750 grand (I'm sure every news channel will have a different figure) and it does seem fiting that he was hiding in a rat hole. And boy will the news be in their glory with something to talk about all day and many days to come oy vey!!

Just a few thoughts for your entertainment .


I never said that the result would be immediate. I fully expect attacks to increase for a time but eventually bottom out if no porgress is made.
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quote:

Originally posted by IceCold:

Impressive,

I figured he would have been out of the country by now. Anyway, we got him

alive! This is a huge plus because he cannot become a martyr for the rebel

cause. Now, what will the US do with him?

Do? They'll slap on a couple of years and send him to prison =

He should be tried and commited to death by firing squad. Cause as long as he's alive there is still a risk of him escaping, thats why I felt they should've shot him dead center when they found him

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quote:

Originally posted by IceCold:

Impressive,

I figured he would have been out of the country by now. Anyway, we got him

alive! This is a huge plus because he cannot become a martyr for the rebel

cause. Now, what will the US do with him?

He is to go 9on trial in front of an Iraqi tribunal that has been put together to try ALL the Baathists. He will be first.

The death sentence is open in this tribunal, so I have a feeling that he will be the first to die in whatever fanciful way they think of.

The Iraqi's are going to be given full reign on this one. The US is not going to interfere in this trial. The Iraqi's will try him and do with him what they will, which will not be pretty, I assure you.

He will get the death penalty,, question is, how many, and since you can only die once, will they make it quick, or extend his pain for as long as possible?

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This is great news to wake up to... and since Sadaam is outside of the continental United States... the Iraqi police could use some unorthodox 'persuasion' methods to figure out some things we would like to know.

Capturing him alive makes even more of an impact... how many people would be yelling "He's a fake!" if we had taken him dead?

Now if OBL is still alive... that would be a couple good tickets to re-election for W...

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quote:

Originally posted by Marvin:

I hope Jaguar is wrong about how Saddam will be tried. Far too many people are still loyal to Saddam; even if they are not part of the tribunal, they can effectively intimidate those who are.

Intimidate them how?

Our troops will protect the families of the tribunal members and most of the tribunals families are already out of the country in protective custody anyway.

They have NOTHING to intimidate with.

We have the metal bat, they have a nerf bat, they won't be intimidating anyone.

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quote:

We have the metal bat, they have a nerf bat, they won't be intimidating anyone.


Really? We can protect everyone, all the time, from the Iraqi resistance? Whoa man, what about all the successful attacks on US troops by the resistance? If we cannot fully protect ourselves how can we protect everyone else? Take a look as Israel and Palestine situation. Even the hard core Israeli army cannot prevent intimidation in their own country. Saddam needs to be turned over to the United Nations to go before an international trial. Show trials are the tools of tyrants and I don't care if the defendant is Hitler himself. Liberty and Justice must apply to all or it means nothing.

Now either Jag or Kalshion will probably say this,

"The UN? Who needs the UN? They are weak and all their power is derived from US military might anyway so we could just save them the trouble and do it ourselves!"

quote:

He will get the death penalty,, question is, how many, and since you can only die once, will they make it quick, or extend his pain for as long as possible?


Torture. You are condoning torture. This is sinking right to Saddam's level of personal enjoyment of the suffering of others. Every human has the right to a fair trial and is innocent until proven guilty. Granted, the prosecution may be very short but the burden of proof is on them.

"Don't be so quick to deal out death and judgment"

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quote:

Originally posted by IceCold:

quote:

We have the metal bat, they have a nerf bat, they won't be intimidating anyone.


Really? We can protect everyone, all the time, from the Iraqi resistance? Whoa man, what about all the successful attacks on US troops by the resistance? If we cannot fully protect ourselves how can we protect everyone else? Take a look as Israel and Palestine situation. Even the hard core Israeli army cannot prevent intimidation in their own country. Saddam needs to be turned over to the United Nations to go before an international trial. Show trials are the tools of tyrants and I don't care if the defendant is Hitler himself. Liberty and Justice must apply to all or it means nothing.

Now either Jag or Kalshion will probably say this,

"The UN? Who needs the UN? They are weak and all their power is derived from US military might anyway so we could just save them the trouble and do it ourselves!"

quote:

He will get the death penalty,, question is, how many, and since you can only die once, will they make it quick, or extend his pain for as long as possible?


Torture. You are condoning torture. This is sinking right to Saddam's level of personal enjoyment of the suffering of others. Every human has the right to a fair trial and is innocent until proven guilty. Granted, the prosecution may be very short but the burden of proof is on them.

"Don't be so quick to deal out death and judgment"


Come on, can we get real here?

we 140 thousand or so troops in Iraq, there is an attack a day, and most attacks have been foiled before they even get going, but you never hear about those, you only hear about the successful attacks. That is ALL you are ever going to hear.

You don't hear about the Iraqi's that are helping us, they are a MAJOR majority by the way, you don't hear about all the Baathists that are in custody and awaiting trial by this tribunal. You don't hear about the electrical system back on track, or the water system running, or the sewage system up to speed. You don't hear about how our troops are helping individual Iraqi's, you don't hear about the schools that have been rebuilt.

You hear ONLY the negative, 4 or 5 a day out of 140,000 is unreal. We lose 2-3 guys a week just in training on some posts, and that is in the US itself. Losing 3-4 a day in a combat situation is unheard of, although if you look at the press the sky is falling.

The Iraqi's can do whatever they want with Saddam as far as I am concerned, the man is responsible for MILLIONS of deaths, and deserves whatever cruel and unusual punishment that his victims can come up with.

Not our country, not our justice.

And the UN, yes, it can go find a place to hide out until we straighten Iraq out. They can just keep their socialistic, stupid mouths shut.

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Guest Remo Williams

quote:

Saddam needs to be turned over to the United Nations to go before an international trial. Show trials are the tools of tyrants and I don't care if the defendant is Hitler himself. Liberty and Justice must apply to all or it means nothing.


Well its been broadcast all morning that the Iraqi people will put him on trial; so there is no chance of that happening. Rightfully so to considering that he commited most of his crimes against his own people. Although I would think the Kuwaiti's should get a shot at him too.

What they do to him is their business now if its death he gets well I can't say that I blame them after the tens of thousands that he slaughtered.

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quote:

we 140 thousand or so troops in Iraq, there is an attack a day, and most attacks have been foiled before they even get going, but you never hear about those, you only hear about the successful attacks. That is ALL you are ever going to hear.


This is the point. The fact that there are successful attacks invalidates the argument that the US troops can assure the protection of anyone in Iraq.

quote:

Not our country, not our justice.

If our rules of justice don't apply to the world, what is the reasoning for our invasion of Iraq?

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quote:

Originally posted by IceCold:

quote:

we 140 thousand or so troops in Iraq, there is an attack a day, and most attacks have been foiled before they even get going, but you never hear about those, you only hear about the successful attacks. That is ALL you are ever going to hear.


This is the point. The fact that there are successful attacks invalidates the argument that the US troops can assure the protection of anyone in Iraq.

quote:

Not our country, not our justice.

If our rules of justice don't apply to the world, what is the reasoning for our invasion of Iraq?


Oh, where do we start here?

The casualty rate is VERY low, and the people that are fighting will not and cannot get to Saddam now, no matter how hard they try.

The US military is protecting far more then you hear about, and the fact of the matter is, it's now going to get easier, NOT harder.

And the reasoning, hmm, let's see, numerous UN resolutions that were broken by Saddam, the fact that the cease fire, yes, CEASE fire from the Gulf War was broken by Saddam, so this is not a NEW war, it is an extension of the old one. WMD's, yes, they exist, it is just a matter of time before they are found. What other reasons can I come up with, a whole load of them, but not what you want to hear.

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quote:

The casualty rate is VERY low, and the people that are fighting will not and cannot get to Saddam now, no matter how hard they try.

The US military is protecting far more then you hear about, and the fact of the matter is, it's now going to get easier, NOT harder.

And the reasoning, hmm, let's see, numerous UN resolutions that were broken by Saddam, the fact that the cease fire, yes, CEASE fire from the Gulf War was broken by Saddam, so this is not a NEW war, it is an extension of the old one. WMD's, yes, they exist, it is just a matter of time before they are found. What other reasons can I come up with, a whole load of them, but not what you want to hear.


The fact that there is a casualty rate underscores the fact that the US cannot protect everyone in Iraq. A 90% success rate denotes a 10% failure rate and people are still being killed over there. Forget about the typical reasoning of the war and focus on your statement that our justice does not apply outside our boarders. How can we justify the projection of our power into other nations where our laws don't apply?

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quote:

They should have taken him out but the powers that be consider he's too valuable a source of information.

...and all the quotes along this line of reasoning.

Jag is right.

It isn't the information gained that is important here. The real message to the Arab world is that the United States is not interested in occupying countries. If we were to take Hussein out, or if we were to try Hussein, it would make the USA look like the world's policemen, which would futher ingratiate us to the world.

By letting the Iraqi people try Hussein on their own terms, we show the world that we were serious about ending terrorism and sponsors of terrorism, but not out to control the world. By letting the Iraqi people judge Hussein, it builds credibility for the new Iraqi government and gives people a sense of faith that they can determine their own future.

quote:

Now either Jag or Kalshion will probably say this,

"The UN? Who needs the UN? They are weak and all their power is derived from US military might anyway so we could just save them the trouble and do it ourselves!"

Remember how the UN cut and ran after their building was attacked?

quote:

The fact that there are successful attacks invalidates the argument that the US troops can assure the protection of anyone in Iraq.

...

The fact that there is a casualty rate underscores the fact that the US cannot protect everyone in Iraq. A 90% success rate denotes a 10% failure rate and people are still being killed over there.


Picking off one or two soldiers at a time does not make a successful attack. How about the fact that their have been more American deaths in Oakland and Washington DC than their have been in Iraq? You have to put it in perspective. And as harsh as this may sound, I would rather have the insurgents pick off one or two soldiers in Iraq (who are trained and signed up for this duty) than to have them pick off 1,000 or 2,000 citizens in New York or Boston.

And for the record, I was a firm believer that Hussein was killed in the first "Shock and Awe" attack.

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saddam seems to be more successful than some think or know. he has succeeded in driving a wedge between NATO countries. and the united nations...

where is the french people that remember that it was the allies, Britain and America that liberated them...how easy people forget their friends.

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