Christmas or Happy Holidays

[LostInSpace]

I'm going to carry this over from the joke section.

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Originally posted by Jaguar:

The scary thing about that, is that it could actually happen in this day and age....

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Sad thing is, is that it is. I guess you haven't heard about the brouhaha here in NYC.

NewsDay:

Lights, camera, legal action

In Huntington, judge works out compromise for town display after lawyer sues, saying it is overly religious

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I'm not anti-religion or against Christmas. This is not an attack on Jesus or Christians," said Pashkin, who declined to disclose his faith...

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I've seen a more recent report on TV that he is indeed Jewish. Makes one think. Why is he attacking just the christmas display, in his own words: " nativity scene, Christmas tree and two signs on the Village Green that read "Peace on Earth" violated his constitutional rights because of their religious overtones", while ignoring the menorah?

Then there's this:

WorldNetDaily:

HOLIDAY BLUES

Christmas carols banned,

but Hanukkah songs OK

District axes 'dogmatic religious statements,' yet suggesting Jewish themes more cultural

[Aperson]

Blah, I was going to call Americans silly, but then found out that this kinda happens in Canada. But not to the extreams listed above.

[John Prezioso]

As an American, it brings me no great pleasure, but I've got to agree, Aperson. 'Silly' doesn't even begin to cover it.

[Captain McMahon]

Group Fights Wal-Mart on 'Happy Holidays'

My take on this is: People don't like change and in a world that is constanting changing, they need to live with it or not.

[Soback]

If by change you mean disregarding the VERY holiday those people are shopping for then yes, all the NORMAL people wouldn't like that.

What holiday would you be refering to when you say Happy Holidays? Would that be the Jewish holiday? Or would that be the made up holiday. If you can't name those two, then you don't even know what that change is.

How about the Christmas tree. Is that a holiday tree? Does that said Jewish holiday have a tree with decorations on it? How about the made up one? So how does a Christmas tree become a holiday tree? You call that change. Some would call it for what it is, screwed up political correctness.

Let me give you a little lesson. In Russia, Communists destroyed Christmas, they made religion illegal. That in turn destroyed tightly knit communities, that destroyed family and then people became property of the state. The state told them where to live (assigning living appartments), the state told them how to live (they judged how big an apartment a family would need), and how to raise their kids. Tell me that at least one of those things is not happening in US with prolifiration of Socialism. Didn't Hillary say it takes a village to raise a child?

Have fun without Christmas, by the end of your life, you probably won't even know what the word Holidays mean, as your kids will be toiling away 365 days a year to support Hillarys and Kennedys offsprings, the few select that will have money, because money is evil and only they should have it, to protect you from evil.

[Aperson]

You lost me Soback.

Holiday refers to anything that gives you an excuse to not work in practise. And since there are quite a few holidays around this time of year that involve buying stu... err giving each other tokens of appreciation, so itÔÇÖs perfectly applicable.

Also there are many religions that have a holiday around this time of year, from Hanukah, to Christmas, to whatever-muslim-holiday-happens-to-land-around-this-time-of-year, to particular pagan holidays that many religions based their holidays on to gain converts.

Plus I fail to see the connection where calling something the "Holiday season" instead of the "Christmas Season" equates to losing holidays. Then again, Americans can be quite good a defying common sense sometimes*.

* That was refering to that said Americans that arn't making sence to get rid of holidays, not you.

[Soback]

Really, what holiday rolls around EVERY YEAR, THIS time of year. It's not Hannukah, it's not any pagan holiday, it's not any muslim holiday, it's CHRISTMAS. What holiday has a tree with decorations? It's NOT any other holiday, so therefore it's NOT a holiday tree, it's CHRISTMAS tree.

So stop calling a Christmas tree a holiday tree. It's like saying that a spoon is a fork. It doesn't make sense. The reason people are NOT saying Merry Christmas at work places, at stores, and the reason they are NOT calling a Christmas tree by IT'S TRUE NAME, A CHRISTMAS TREE, is because the liberals have gotten the employers so afraid of getting sued for discrimination that political correctness has rotten their brains. Everything needs to be watered down and everything needs to be run by the lawyers as to come up with the name for Christmas and Christmas tree as to still be able to celebrate it, but at the same time NOT to be sued by ACLU and other scum. So the name was born, Holiday tree.

Lets call the Menorah a holiday candle holder. Lets call the Qur'an a past time recreational book, calling it a religious book will offend Jews and Christians. And we don't want to offend anyone do we?

I don't see Conservatives suing anyone because they sell Menorah under the name Menorah. Do you? The only people I see medling in other peoples affairs all the time are liberals. That's what creates so much chaos. They have to stick their stupid heads into every persons life and tell them how to live it. If they would only let people live their lives, celebrate their holidays, everything would be fine. But no, word Christmas will offend Jews and Muslims. Word Hannukah will offend Christians and Muslims. Word Ramadan will offend Jews and Chsristians. So we are going to tell everyone to just call everything Holidays. If they would just stay out, and leave people be, everything would be FINE. Christians would celebreate Christmas, Muslims would celebrate Ramadan, and Jews would celebreate Hunnukah. And others would celebrate whatever they want.

It's JUST like the argument about race. He is black, he is white, he is yellow. So we have to be politically correct and call him an Asian American, and the other guy is Sout American , or Mexican American, and black is not black but African American. They are driving people NUTS. Nobody CARES if you are black, white, yellow, green. The ONLY thing liberals do with this crap is have people ARGUE all the time, instead of just being people and going along living their lives.

[ 12-18-2005, 07:08 PM: Message edited by: Soback ]

[Aperson]

quote:

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Originally posted by Soback:

Really, what holiday rolls around EVERY YEAR, THIS time of year. It's not Hannukah, it's not any pagan holiday, it's not any muslim holiday, it's CHRISTMAS. What holiday has a tree with decorations? It's NOT any other holiday, so therefore it's NOT a holiday tree, it's CHRISTMAS tree.

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Eh? Correct me if I'm wrong, but Hanukah and the Winter Solstice are only off a few days from Christmas.

quote:

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Originally posted by Soback:

Second, Thrid, and Fourth Paragraph

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Calling whatever a holiday object is perfectly right, just less specific. ItÔÇÖs an object for a holiday hence holiday _________. But in any case I would agree that getting in a kerfulffle over the name is silly (this would of course apply to both getting in a kerfulffle over it "needing" to be called the Christmas season or it "needing" to be called the holiday season).

[Guest $iLk]

If only these people getting upset at the 'persecution' of having to bear the brunt of "Happy Holidays" got as upset about the genocide of Christians around the world...

Still - anyone who is offended by a greeting such as "merry christmas" is retarded. So are people who are offended by "happy holidays".

[Guest]

What I found REALLY amusing, is there is a lowes sign.

In english, it says that Lowes has "holiday" trees for sale, BUT, in spanish, it says CHRISTMAS trees for sale.....

SO I guess if you speak english you would be offended by Christmas, BUT NOT if you speak Spanish.

[Aperson]

quote:

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Originally posted by Jaguar:

What I found REALLY amusing, is there is a lowes sign.

In english, it says that Lowes has "holiday" trees for sale, BUT, in spanish, it says CHRISTMAS trees for sale.....

SO I guess if you speak english you would be offended by Christmas, BUT NOT if you speak Spanish.

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Roger that's proof that English makes people go crazy when not off-set by another language.

[Guest $iLk]

In America we have to put up with hearing 'Holiday Tree' in Muslim countries we have to put up with having our heads removed.

I guess I just look for the negative lately.

[Kalshion]

I'm disappointed..

NO ONE HERE EVEN BOTHERED TO MENTION WHAT CHRISTMAS IS ABOUT!?

For those of you who don't know what the day of christmas really is: IT'S THE BIRTH OF CHRIST!

I'm not going any further, this just burns me up that people want to insult the birth of christ and turn it into a shopping day

[Aperson]

True... which is why I found it funny that the people wanted the company to call it Christmas.

Then again, isn't there proof that Jesus might have been born sometime in March?

[Guest]

quote:

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Originally posted by Kalshion:

I'm disappointed..

NO ONE HERE EVEN BOTHERED TO MENTION WHAT CHRISTMAS IS ABOUT!?

For those of you who don't know what the day of christmas really is: IT'S THE BIRTH OF CHRIST!

I'm not going any further, this just burns me up that people want to insult the birth of christ and turn it into a shopping day

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Do you REALLY want me to go there Kalshion? LOL

[Kalshion]

quote:

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Originally posted by Jaguar:

quote:

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Originally posted by Kalshion:

I'm disappointed..

NO ONE HERE EVEN BOTHERED TO MENTION WHAT CHRISTMAS IS ABOUT!?

For those of you who don't know what the day of christmas really is: IT'S THE BIRTH OF CHRIST!

I'm not going any further, this just burns me up that people want to insult the birth of christ and turn it into a shopping day

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Do you REALLY want me to go there Kalshion? LOL

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No

[Charles Lindsey]

...and a Jovial Festivus to all.

(Happy and Merry were taken, I call dibs on Jovial)

[LostInSpace]

quote:

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Originally posted by Aperson:

True... which is why I found it funny that the people wanted the company to call it Christmas.

Then again, isn't there proof that Jesus might have been born sometime in March?

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when Christianity became the official religion of Rome, Constantine made it more palatable to the peasants by superimposing Christian saints onto the existing pagan deities and adapting Christian beliefs to pagan customs. Most notably, the winter solstice celebration of the rebirth of the Sun became Christ's Mass, or the birth of the Son. This method of gradual assumption of new names for old beliefs is much less traumatic and indeed might hardly have been noticed by the average peasant. Constantine could rename the winter celebration and create new symbols to associate it with the virgin birth of Christ, but in most cases the citizenry simply continued their former frolics "under new management."

Within a hundred years of this edict, most of the pagan cults had died out and Christianity was ensconced as the official religion of the ever-expanding Roman Empire. Prince Vladimir would use this same technique in 987 when he facilitated Russia's transition to Christianity by superimposing the Christian saints onto the feast days of the former pagan deities and folk heroes; the feast day of John the Baptist, for example, would be celebrated in the same season and manner as the former river deity. From the Middle Ages to the Reformation, Christmas week became an elaborate religious celebration, characterized by long church services and sermons offset by music, plays, and masques. This was a stark and solemn contrast to the vulgar, pagan festivities of the original winter solstice, which included drinking, gambling, and sex. Yet the side-by-side celebration of the most profound with the most profane continued through the centuries, culminating in our own culture's mixing of the most sacred of holidays, Christmas, with the most hedonistic of holidays, New Year's Eve. The British were not praying as Washington crossed the Delaware, they were drinking. Even St. Nicholas, the Greek Orthodox priest on whom Santa Claus is patterned, shares a schizophrenic name with "Old Nick," one of the common slang names for Satan!

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The split personality of our winter holiday has endured for more than 2,000 years, and that pattern is likely to continue as governments seek to influence the masses by controlling their Masses. Some complained that solstice rituals were too pagan, and Christmas was born; others complained that Christmas was too Christian, and Santa Claus emerged; some complain today that the holidays have become too commercial, but even louder, Keynesian voices complain that we aren't commercial enough ÔÇö without "healthy" Christmas sales, our economy will falter. I suspect the conflict will rage a long time, as humans seek a balance between the profound and the profane, the commercial and the personal, the spiritual and the pagan, self-interest and self-sacrifice. The two-faced Roman god Janus, who sits on the cusp between the old year and the new, will continue to preside over this schizophrenic holiday of merriment and wonder.

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There's also another pretty good read over at Wikipedia about the theories regarding the origin of the date of Christmas.