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Bush: Broadband for the people by 2007

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Not to go political right off BUT

quote:

Gore claims he invented it

Yeah Urban Myth. Various news sources and truthorfiction.com say Gore was on the Commission that approved the internet. Or something like that. They all state that he himself never claimed to have invented the internet.

There is an old thread around here somewhere that DragonLady participated in. The topic of discussion was whether the gov should subsidize broadband for everybody or at least the rural regions. At the time I supported it but with ever increasing tech it may not be needed.

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Guest $iLk

Ummm... they have a recording of Gore:

"I took the initiative in creating the internet" - Al Gore

I've got it somewhere on my computer, but it was during an interview on CNN he said this.

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This new Broadband will be Broadband over powerlines, which we have EVERYWHERE, so everyone will be able to access the internet by pluggin a modem into the nearest socket of their house.

The only problem with this technology is that it is RF noisy, and ham radio operators, like myself are against this technology because HF goes right out the window, we cannot hear anything BUT the BOP, which kills our HF bands completely and makes them useless, and EVERYONE has power lines near their homes, so no matter where a Ham radio operator goes, the HF bands will be dead because of the Broadband over powerlines.

The only good thing about it is that it is cheap, and very easy to install. So this isn't just an empty promise by Bush, it is VERY real.

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quote:

Ummm... they have a recording of Gore:

Ummm... where, pray tell, is the word "invent" in that quote? Creating and inventing are two different things. That is the Urban Myth. That he claimed to have invented the internet.

http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/g/goreinternet.htm

He did try to take credit for the camcorder though.

quote:

This new Broadband will be Broadband over powerlines, which we have EVERYWHERE

So THAT'S why that spammer keeps posting on Yahoo. Trying to drum up business for his fake broadband over powerline deal. Otherwise that's good news.

quote:

the HF bands will be dead because of the Broadband over powerlines.

That's gotta be disappointing. Bet they go for the "greater good".

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quote:

Originally posted by Jaguar:

The only problem with this technology is that it is RF noisy, and ham radio operators, like myself are against this technology because HF goes right out the window, we cannot hear anything BUT the BOP, which kills our HF bands completely and makes them useless, and EVERYONE has power lines near their homes, so no matter where a Ham radio operator goes, the HF bands will be dead because of the Broadband over powerlines.

I did hear this problem put rather funnily (I thought) - any passing aliens will wonder why the whole planet is beaming lots of pictures of naked women at them.

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quote:

This new Broadband will be Broadband over powerlines, which we have EVERYWHERE, so everyone will be able to access the internet by pluggin a modem into the nearest socket of their house.

And taxpayers will pay for that?

Most of the population in Qu├®bec have access to both cable and DSL broadband. Lines have been installed/adapted by the cable/phone companies, and the broadband network in Qu├®bec is one of the fastest and most reliable (and cheap!) in America. Why can't the US companies do it themselves?

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quote:


Originally posted by Epsilon 5:

quote:

This new Broadband will be Broadband over powerlines, which we have EVERYWHERE, so everyone will be able to access the internet by pluggin a modem into the nearest socket of their house.

And taxpayers will pay for that?

Most of the population in Qu├®bec have access to both cable and DSL broadband. Lines have been installed/adapted by the cable/phone companies, and the broadband network in Qu├®bec is one of the fastest and most reliable (and cheap!) in America. Why can't the US companies do it themselves?


Telephone 101:

Most of Americas' Telephone system was installed by the company that bore the name of the man who obtained the first patent for the Telephone.

The Bell Telephone Co. spread far and fast. When the company approached monopoly status, our steadfast stewards in DC deemed it appropriate to bust the company up.

On the technical side, we have enough "old" copper telephone wire strung on the poles to go to the moon and back numerous times. Therein lies the problem. The lines are very old. They do fine for carrying voice signals, but high speed digital signals run into some serious roadblocks like chokes and amplifiers. We have so many little telephone companies now,(We call them Baby Bells) that it wouldn't be economically feasible for the older and larger ones to string new wire.

Copper is the cheapest metal one can get for pushing electrons, Gold being the best, but just like any metal, in any application, it will begin to break down with age and use.

Now, with the advent of cable television and all new shielded wire strung to every home, it is a great medium for transmitting high speed data.

It's good but it's not perfect. Nothing is.LOL

Cable internet access suffers from a phenomena called overcrowding. If you live in a large neighborhood,the cable company will have strung a "loop" from their main line, through the neighborhood. A connection to the "loop" is dropped to each home. If you find yourself at the back side of the loop,every connection ahead of yours will degrade your speed and, at times, can even deny you access to the net due to the load on the loop, if all of your neighbors are surfing at the same time.

Transmitting high speed digital signals on the strict 60 hertz carrier wave(called "Piggybacking") of high power lines is the next best alternative because it won't cost anyone an arm and two legs to implement.

No, the taxpayers won't be footing the bill.

/Wolferz clamps his nose shut and jumps into the gator infested water.....

Jag, I am schooled in Electronics, but I never found ham radio interesting enough to pursue.

Even though my Telecommunications instructor was a certified genius in that industry. This guy was part of the sonar and radar research and development during WW II, and he wrote the book on anti-submarine warfare. It was a true priviledge to be tutored by this man. So, I have a question: "How will high speed data transmission over high power lines affect ham radio frequencies?

I know that power lines create an electromagnetic field around the wire that can interfere with radio waves, but how exactly would a high speed square wave, piggybacked on a 60 Hz Sine wave carrier signal, interfere with high band radio?

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quote:

Jag, I am schooled in Electronics, but I never found ham radio interesting enough to pursue.

Even though my Telecommunications instructor was a certified genius in that industry. This guy was part of the sonar and radar research and development during WW II, and he wrote the book on anti-submarine warfare. It was a true priviledge to be tutored by this man. So, I have a question: "How will high speed data transmission over high power lines affect ham radio frequencies?

I know that power lines create an electromagnetic field around the wire that can interfere with radio waves, but how exactly would a high speed square wave, piggybacked on a 60 Hz Sine wave carrier signal, interfere with high band radio?


First off the BPL, is NOT and electronic signal, it is a RADIO signal over power lines.

Power lines become a HUGE antenna for the BPL signal, and the signal will shoot off into space, and does.

Why BPL is a bad idea

Amateur Radio Relay League articles

I am also a member of the above organization, ARRL.

This is a mess, and unless the BPL guys can clean it up, it ain't gonna happen, and if it does, emergency communications around the country are going to suffer, because BPL and it's harmonics will literally destroy the spectrum that we use for long distance communications.

Oh, and be ready for some other fun things coming from the FCC, Plasma televisions are next on the hit list. If you own a Plasma TV and it interferes with a ham radio operator, which they do, it is YOUR responsibility as the owner of said plasma TV to get rid of that interference. So far the only way to do that is to turn it off when the Ham is on the air. LOL and legally, you would be required to do that if a complaint was issued.

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quote:

Originally posted by Jaguar:

The only problem with this technology is that it is RF noisy, and ham radio operators, like myself are against this technology because HF goes right out the window, we cannot hear anything BUT the BOP, which kills our HF bands completely and makes them useless, and EVERYONE has power lines near their homes, so no matter where a Ham radio operator goes, the HF bands will be dead because of the Broadband over powerlines.

hey, Jaguar. Glad to see your into ham radio. I doubt the idea of broadband piggybacked on the power grid will be implimented any too soon. If so, looks like building better filters, would be appropriate. Hard for me to imagine, full duplex repeaters with transmitters and recievers sitting on top each other, and using the same antenna, can

filter out interference from each other, but a decent antenna system placed above the power lines, could not function in the hf with proper filtering techniques.

anyway, "thats what morse code is for", it is tremedously proficiant at getting through the most horribly imagined conditions....73,s

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Now that you mention it,yes there is a possibility that the wires, towers, and any nearby metallic structure Could retransmit the radio signal being used by the power company for the BPL. But wouldn't that be dependant on the power applied to the signal and the load in ohms of the device that would act as the transmission antenna?

From what I gleaned from the links, everything is still in the test phase and every mention of interference included the word "could."

In the past I have had Ham signals bleeding into my cable TV signal, which is strictly against FCC regulations. I checked all of the shielded cabling in my home for possible leaks, found none and decided if the problem continued I would contact the cable company to check their cables.It was isolated and intermittent interference from the hammie, and my guess is possibly one of the hammies' neighbors asked him to check his antenna because the problem never occurred more than one or two times.

Also I find it hard to fathom that any plasma TV on the market would or could be found "Not" in compliance with FCC interference regs.

Did the FCC slip on those appliances or what?

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The problem is that there are 2 types of televisions, inexpensive, and expensive.

1/2 the plasma televisions out there are actually class A devices, which is for industrial/commercial use, the other is class B, which is for residential use.

Class A televisions are cheaper to make, and ALL the cheap Plasma TV's are indeed Class A devices, and even state it in the manual.

This makes them RF powerhouse noisemakers, they kill the higher HF bands and the VHF and UHF bands are toast within a 1/2 mile of these monsters. Yes, I said 1/2 a mile.

The problem is that people are indeed buying the Cheaper ones, and they are all class A, when they turn them on, the Ham radio operator is toast in most of the most popular bandwidth.

Oh and as far as "could" it is more like "does", I have talked to a number of hams that are involved, in testing for it, and there is NO doubt that the interference they have discovered is indeed CAUSED by the BPL.

This interferance is in the Shortwave and HF bands, the LONG distance bands, so this interference will not just be local, these frequencies can really go the distance let me tell you.

You are also not taking into accounts the harmonics of these bands, so not only is it interfering with the frequency they are actually on, but are also interfering on all bands that they harmonize on. So it gets REALLY spread out, and hashes the heck out of the HF and shortwave bands.

Also, you keep thinking that power is what creates the problem, but it's NOT, it's the frequency. Power is great for "short" distances, but I can transmit in the milliwatts in the 20 meter band and be heard in africa clear as a bell, I know, because I've done it.

It's not the power that's the problem, because the transmit power of the BPL can be probably calculated in the 5 watt range, but the frequency is what creates the problem, and all of it's harmonics, because it is DIRTY, and I mean DIRTY!!

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/ramble mode on

Ham radio operators can also be a problem. A friend of ours had a paraplegic neighbor who liked to use ham radio (note: this is in the 80's). When the ham radio was in operation, he could not get any signal whatsoever on his TV or radio. His grandchild, unhappy that he couldn't watch his TV cartoon, actually went next door one day and asked the neighbor to stop. Which he did (nice of him to do so).

My parents' house was about a block away, and you could always tell when the ham guy was on the air because even their TV reception would suffer; not as bad as our friend next door to him though.

We strongly suspect he was operating way over the allowable legal power limits for that device, since he claimed he could carry on conversations which should have been beyond ham radio range. The problem was that when his neighbors would complain, judges would take pity on him (being handicapped) since he maintained that was how he kept in touch with his friends. Not that I'm against that, but my friend didn't see why he had to used boosted power levels.

/ramble off

My point? If a ham radio operator can complain about a TV owner, a TV owner can also complain about a ham radio operator too.

And maybe this is a dumb question, but if a class "A" plasma TV isn't rated for residential use, why do they sell them to home-owners?

Not to mention, how's the ham radio operator going to figure out of all the people who live within a half-mile radius owns the device? He may suspect, but he can't enter someone's house to prove anything...

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Interesting discussion. PArt of what Jag said made me remember something. What's that warning you see on various devices "This device is a class such and such device. This device must not cause any interference with x but must accept any interference it receives"? I always thought it was to protect television signals. Gotta keep the masses numb ya know? Does it mean something else and I'm just extremely naive on the subject?

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quote:

Originally posted by Joel Schultz:

/ramble mode on

Ham radio operators
can
also be a problem. A friend of ours had a paraplegic neighbor who liked to use ham radio (note: this is in the 80's). When the ham radio was in operation, he could not get any signal whatsoever on his TV or radio. His grandchild, unhappy that he couldn't watch his TV cartoon, actually went next door one day and asked the neighbor to stop. Which he did (nice of him to do so).

My parents' house was about a block away, and you could always tell when the ham guy was on the air because even their TV reception would suffer; not as bad as our friend next door to him though.

We strongly suspect he was operating way over the allowable legal power limits for that device, since he claimed he could carry on conversations which should have been beyond ham radio range. The problem was that when his neighbors would complain, judges would take pity on him (being handicapped) since he maintained that was how he kept in touch with his friends. Not that I'm against that, but my friend didn't see why he had to used boosted power levels.

/ramble off

My point? If a ham radio operator can complain about a TV owner, a TV owner can also complain about a ham radio operator too.

And maybe this is a dumb question, but if a class "A" plasma TV isn't rated for residential use, why do they sell them to home-owners?

Not to mention, how's the ham radio operator going to figure out of all the people who live within a half-mile radius owns the device? He may suspect, but he can't enter someone's house to prove anything...

ramble is right

And you have confused Ham radio with CB, not surprising.

We strongly suspect he was operating way over the allowable legal power limits for that device, since he claimed he could carry on conversations which should have been beyond ham radio range.

The above statement is what made that obvious, because I can run 1500watts, LEGALLY, and talk to the moon if I feel like it, and I do, we use the moon as a giant repeater, we bounce our signals off of it to reach out of line of site stations, if I can hit the moon, I can talk to anyone else that the moon is in line of site of. that is called moonbounce, but I can also talk to the north pole, which I have, Africa, which I have, Australia, which I have, ad nauseum, without using the moon, just at 100 watts, or less, 20 milliwatts on 20 meter got me a station in South Africa.

You are obviously thinking that Ham radio and CB are the same thing...

CB radio will indeed bleed everywhere if overpowered, because of the fact that it is CHEAP equipment. I can go out, buy a CB radio for less then $100, pump 1000 watts through and everyone within a mile of me is gonna hear me through their stereos, TV's, Telephones, etc.

Ham radios on the other hand are built with filters, grounding, etc, etc. I may bleed through my neighbors TV a little bit if I am NOT properly filtered at 100 watts, which is what MOST HF radios transmit power is set to from the factory, but it will be VERY little, and if it does bother them, they can tell me and most likely I can put a bandpass filter inline and fix it, or just ground my system a little better.

If I bleed through someones stereo, it is MY responsibility to fix it, just as the same token, if someones Plasma TV is tearing apart my spectrum, it is their responsibility to fix it.

Also, my HF rig, when new cost over $800, used I bought it for $450. It is a 100watt unit, which can put out a max of 150 watts, and I can legally put a 1500 watt amp on it without any trouble at all, although with that kind of power my touch lamps turn on and off all by themselves, which is fun to watch, and freaks out any company you might have over, but that is because of the power requirements of the amplifier.

As per your last question, a manufacturer can sell Class A equipment all day long, as long as in the manual it says for Industrial/commercial use only. Problem is that the new residential owner has bought themselves a world of trouble if that Plasma bleeds into a nearby ham.

but QUIT confusing CB radio and Ham.

CB Radio is Anarchy.

Ham Radio, I am licensed by the FEDERAL Government to operate on the ham bands allowed to me on my class of license, and in case of emergency, I am licensed to run on ANY band I need in order to communicate where I need to.

I have been a Ham since 1987, have been involved in too many emergency excercises to count, and 5 REAL emergencies, earthquake, A flood, a major fire, and 2 major windstorms. Power was out, cellphones were out, telephone was out, the ONLY way to communicate was via Ham radio. It is IMPORTANT that our bands are left alone, and with as little interference as possible, because if the excrement hits the fan, we're it, as far as communications go.

During the California Earthquakes, up here in Washington we were running traffic for the emergency services, because they had NOTHING but ham radio operators to get the word out.

Oh and for the very last question about how do we find someone bleeding into our spectrum.

Hams' are some of the best RF hunters there are, the FCC will sometimes ask us for our services to run down pirate radio stations, illegal CBr's etc.

It is SO EASY to run down where RF interference is coming from that it is insane, oh, and if you have a baby monitor, or an old nondigital wireless telephone, expect that someone is listening, because I assure you, someone is...LOL

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quote:

Originally posted by Cmdr Chavik:

Interesting discussion. PArt of what Jag said made me remember something. What's that warning you see on various devices "This device is a class such and such device. This device must not cause any interference with x but must accept any interference it receives"? I always thought it was to protect television signals. Gotta keep the masses numb ya know? Does it mean something else and I'm just extremely naive on the subject?

yes, the reason it says that is that the FCC requires that ANY new device, if it is a class B, must accept any INPUT, which means unfiltered noise, such as the CB I was talking about above, but it is NOT allowed to screw up the spectrum, by putting out it's own interference.

in other words, it must NOT put out ANY RF noise, but must accept any RF noise.

Kind of weird, but it does help keep our RF spectrum clean, except when you are talking about Class A Plasma televisions in peoples houses, I can't wait to see the fallout from that...

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quote:

Interesting discussion. PArt of what Jag said made me remember something. What's that warning you see on various devices "This device is a class such and such device.

those are lables, which manufacturers place on electronic equipment "FCC compliance verification or certification under part 15, subpart B, section 15,1003,paragraph © of FCC rules.

Most of them state." this device MUST accept interference, even if the interference may cause a n undesirable affect of its intended operation" If the device does not fall into the catagory which requires FCC complience verification.

This only applies to US manufactured or foreign imports(for sale in the US or US territories.

Copies of Part 15 of the FCC rules can be obtained from the FCC web site at http://www.fcc.gov

I also hold a Ham or Amateur Radio ticket, and though, I have noticed some interference on various HF bands during some weather conditions, which may(or may NOT) be due to local plasma televisions, I see very little difference between the level of interference we hams endure today, and that which we endured 30 years ago.

Besides, 80% of HF intereference is atmosphere related, and only about 20% man made. HF is a really lousy way to communicate, and extremely out dated. The sooner we HAMS get into the more advanced idea of using the satalites and repeater nodes, coupled with intergrating our old, and outdated concepts with the new ideas and experimentation: The sooner, we Hams can once again, consider ourselves worthy to be called Hams. I remember when, I had to build my equipment, or not have any equipment. Today, they just buy a radio, and have no idea how to filter out specific noise or signals, and raise the signal to noise ratio in their recievers.

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quote:

Besides, 80% of HF intereference is atmosphere related, and only about 20% man made. HF is a really lousy way to communicate, and extremely out dated. The sooner we HAMS get into the more advanced idea of using the satalites and repeater nodes, coupled with intergrating our old, and outdated concepts with the new ideas and experimentation: The sooner, we Hams can once again, consider ourselves worthy to be called Hams. I remember when, I had to build my equipment, or not have any equipment. Today, they just buy a radio, and have no idea how to filter out specific noise or signals, and raise the signal to noise ratio in their recievers.


Now we are going to bump heads again, I love HF, and have no idea where you are coming from.

Cell phones are based on Ham radio concepts, Meteor burst is based on original ham radio experimentation, microwave communications in the gigahertz range is a ham radio innovation, satelite communication is an EVERYDAY occurance with us, shoot we now have I believe 10 Oscar satelites in orbit, and freedom will soon have a ham repeater system up as well.

I have no idea how involved you are in the hobby, but I am the technical committee chairperson for my local club, this year at field day we are actually going to have some experimental laser communications going on, a moonbounce station set up, a microwave station set up, and the laser and the microwave are BOTH homebrew systems, even the antennas, if that is what you want to call them.

HF is a VERY important part of ham radio, and now we also have priviledges on the 12 and 17 meter band as well, which opens it even further for experimentation. We have HF repeater systems on right now, where I can transmit on 2 meter here in Washington, it will be repeated on 10 or 15 or 20 meter, depending on conditions, and repeated again on 2 meter in Japan. We have a FULL HF repeater system put together across the midwest on 6 meter, and 6 meter repeaters are getting more popular as the equipment becomes more available.

Ever heard of the Gia net? The gia net is a repeater system that stretches across from Texas clear into California, over 100 2 meter repeaters linked up via HF, Packet, land line, and satelite. it is unbeleivable.

And why would you want to build a dirty noisy homebrew, when you can pick up one of the most technologically advanced pieces of equipment in the world, for less then you could even think of building it?

We hams are still on the forefront of technology and always will be, as long as the spectrum remains clean, and we are allowed to play as we always do.

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LOL Jag, I knew that was going to fire you up. lol you probably know me....LOL

I agree with your reference the advances in technology...but maybe I have my own ideas, as to what is classified as advanced. Yes, I work satallites. I have so many qso cards I now just drop them in a box.(I use to put them in scrap books, and even framed some of the more memorable ones).

but in good nature: "how dare you call my old home brews dirty... I could put my old station next to any of the new fangled digital equipment any day"

Now, rather than build the old stuff, I build my own designs, using proto-boards, w/surface mount technology...cheaper/better than you could buy an alinco....lol(believe it or not)

But yes you are correct, REMEMBER PACK RAT?

Now, for everones information: Pack Rat was a packet communication device, which the internet was developed and is still based. As well as phone modems and the new DSL everyone is familiar with.

Gore invented NOTHING..he only help impliment what was already invented. "BY A HAM OPERATOR"

Oh....

(just picken at u jag!)

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quote:

Originally posted by street:

LOL Jag, I knew that was going to fire you up. lol you probably know me....LOL

I agree with your reference the advances in technology...but maybe I have my own ideas, as to what is classified as advanced. Yes, I work satallites. I have so many qso cards I now just drop them in a box.(I use to put them in scrap books, and even framed some of the more memorable ones).

but in good nature: "how dare you call my old home brews dirty... I could put my old station next to any of the new fangled digital equipment any day"

Now, rather than build the old stuff, I build my own designs, using proto-boards, w/surface mount technology...cheaper/better than you could buy an alinco....lol(believe it or not)

But yes you are correct, REMEMBER PACK RAT?

Now, for everones information: Pack Rat was a packet communication device, which the internet was developed and is still based. As well as phone modems and the new DSL everyone is familiar with.

Gore invented NOTHING..he only help impliment what was already invented. "BY A HAM OPERATOR"

Oh....

(just picken at u jag!)

LOL, I hear that.

I knew Dr Chandler of AEA, of Isopole antenna fame, I have a 2 meter and 440 isopole, love those antennas, also had an old AEA Paket machine, but have the new KLM I think it is, don't have it hooked up right now because I live in a duplex, but have my 10 meter vertical, Ex5/8 wave 11meter antenna, (CB for those that don't know what that is) set up and a 15 20 and 40 meter vertical as well. Have a 2 meter beam up, little 4 element Cushcraft, and a new 11 element 220, which is 10 feet long, so trying to figure out whether I can put it up without putting up another mast, oh, and almost forgot, my 6 meter vertical. That's just my base station.

In my car, I have a Webster bandspanner for HF 10 meter to 80 meter, a 2 meter/440 Larsen window mount, 220 mag mount, and 6 meter bumper mount, and a K-40 hood mount CB antenna for my 148 GTL CB...LOL For when I want to talk to truckers about traffic or am convoying with friends who aren't hams.

When I buy my property which will be in the next 8 months, I will be setting up my satelite commo stuff, my KLM triband beam, 36 foot boom and 6 elements, and my Brand spanking new 6 meter beam, on top of my 60 foot tower which is laying in sections under my mom's deck, alond with all my verticals of course, because I like to talk with ALL ham radio operators, not just those using Yagis. LOL, little ham joke....

It's a vertical/Horizontal thing, you wouldn't understand....LOL

Street would, but the rest of you probably won't.

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quote:

those are lables

Obviously.

Didn't answer my question though. I only wanted the factoid, not research. But research I did. I found this definition of interference

quote:

2) INTERFERENCE: ANY UNWANTED RADIO FREQUENCY SIGNAL THAT PREVENTS YOU FROM WATCHING TELEVISION, LISTENING TO YOUR RADIO OR STEREO, OR TALKING ON YOUR TELEPHONE

Background

Interference is any unwanted radio frequency signal that prevents you from watching television, listening to your radio or stereo, or talking on your telephone. Interference may prevent reception altogether, may cause only a temporary loss of a signal, or may affect the quality of the sound or picture produced by your equipment.

in two places so that must be the accepted FCC definition of interference.

I also found this.

quote:

The Commission's rules require private land mobile radio station licensees to take ``reasonable precautions to avoid causing harmful interference. This includes monitoring the transmitting frequency for communications in progress and such other measures as may be necessary to minimize the potential for causing interference.'' 47 C.F.R.§ 90.403(e).

My "boom box" has the first warning as does my newer 27" television however an ancient 13" color does not.

Another factoid learned.

quote:

Gore invented NOTHING..

THANK YOU!!! That's the point I was making. He was careful to use the word create but it got all out of proportion.

quote:

he only help impliment what was already invented.

Which is probably what he meant but phrased it very poorly. I'll certainly admit that much.

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I totally blew past Jaguar's explanation. Apologies to street for my sarcasm. I understand better now. Thanks all.

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quote:

Originally posted by Jaguar:

So far the only way to do that is to turn it off

Not true, you could build a Farraday cage around the offending Plasma T.V.. Better yet, encase the room you plan to put the Plasma (or other offending devices) with a Farraday cage.

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quote:


but QUIT confusing CB radio and Ham

I always thought CB was for cars and truckers -- portable radio, like walkie-talkie, but with much better range. The guy had a big metal tower in his backyard, which I always thought was for ham radio. I take it some CB systems us via fixed ground antenna, not just ham?

Huh. Learned something new, I guess.

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Whew! My Fron is spinning LOL

I have been chuckling to myself while reading through this thread and picturing Jag feverishly thumbing through his equipment specs binder/s to get all those equipment model numbers,

Calculating radio waves and the antenna lengths needed to transmit them, etc etc

Don't take this the wrong way, but Hams are somewhat obsessive compulsive individuals

And they have been extremely instrumental in making the vital communication systems we have today. I salute you all.

Going off on a tangent now....

The Electronics school that I attended was blessed with several Geniuses as instructors.

The most memorable was a quirky individual named Fred Snyder. Snyder was a graduate of Rose Holman, which is a feat unto itself. I was fortunate enough to have him as an instructor in the Solid State and Digital semesters of the two year curriculum. He was a genuine "Freq"

He and I butted intellects many times. During one of our lab classes, we had a test exercise on transistor signal amplification. I had the components set up and the O-Scope attached, showing a perfect wave form. While Mr Snyder was circulating through the other students, grading their tests and eating the flunkers alive, I casually reached to the amplitude knob on my signal generator and turned it up just enough to send the signal way above it's base carrier voltage. The perfect wave form disappeared leaving only the flat line on the O-Scope. Mr Snyder came up behind me and I ask him. "Isn't that the best signal you have ever seen?" His response was an immediate sarcastic,"Mr N***** You don't even HAVE a signal! I said,"Wait a sec, let me turn this down." I "luckily" spun the knob to just the right spot, showing the exact waveform we were testing.

His response was again sarcastic, "Mr N***** you have the hands of a safecracker and YOU scare me."

After that, he was always trying to trip me up, and I was always one step ahead of him. Pissed him off to no end. He was especially sadistic to dumb questions and stereo equipment salesmen. He made learning a very dry subject fun. I learned alot from a guy who almost tore down his dorm in college with a man made earthquake, by setting a very large anplifier against a main column and dialing into the harmonic frequency of the building with a signal generator. After the building began shaking and a very large crack appeared in the column, he tutned it off. I think if anyone could make BPL work, it would be him. In the mean time, I'll stick with my DSL and be happy.

Edit: BPL by 2007? Bush is full of shit, like always

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