Ben Zwycky

OK, the next fleet tournament match is next Sunday at 1900GMT if my memory serves me right (I forget where it was posted), so who is able and willing to defend the glory of our fleet?

Sorry for my abscence, but it was just too late a start for me. As it turned out, I didn't save myself much sleep- my boys got me up at 2.30am anyway Could someone please fill me in on what was discussed?

Look forward to seeing more of you, then We're looking at getting a bargain basement (for here) ADSL link (256/64) sometime soon, which will be a nice step up from 56K

quote: Originally posted by Quazar: Note: I have edited my post in Earthcom's Pinboard thread to answer your question, Dreada (to keep this thread on topic). quote:Originally posted by DREADA: I personally wouldn't have problem with that time, but I think others will! I suggested 12.00AM BST coz working folks on CDT/PDT etc would probably be home by then. I was also thinking of Ben Zwycky (new ISS Fleet Leader), who is currently on CEST (GMT +2). If we held the meeting at 23:00 GMT, then that would be 1AM for him. Yup, that's true- yikes!

sure- and correct your sig, you should be in the 52nd EFFS, unless you want to give up your fighter career (see the fleet sigs thread) [ 09-23-2004, 02:34 PM: Message edited by: Ben Zwycky ]

OK, then.

Seems to be down.

That would indeed be cool, but then we'd end up with lots of different versions of the animations, which are already relatively big files, so that would delay page loading significantly for those of us on slower connections (10 different fleet gifs x 300k each = 3MB) I think a simple line of text in the sig (in between fleet position and animated logo) will suffice. Btw, you should start using the CIOPS logo in your sig. Is your ftp account at iss.galcom.net working now? Could you download the logos from my gallery (in my ship's website, link is in my sig) and upload them over the top of the current ones (the locations are given in the fleet sigs thread)

OK, there's also the possibility of assaulting a city (destroying all the military buildings in an enemy city) as a step up to assaulting a base, since they are less heavily defended. It was a good time away (without the kids for once (my parents came over to look after them)- they grew up so much in just one week!) I'd be cautious about incorporating medals into this, (as Zane suggested in the other thread) since this is more of a training thing than an outstanding performance of duty (which is what medals are for) It could just be a note in their personnel files on our homepage "Certified level 4" or something) (or at the most a line of text in their sig) Did I miss anything important?

As you can see from my sig, the animated logos uploaded at iss.galcom.net are now available and ready for use. As soon as my ftp account is activated, I'll upload the new versions ontop of these ones, so people's sigs will be updated without us having to change anything. (or Zane or Nick could do it using the gifs in my gallery) All fleet signatures should be in the format given above. Those of you in CIOPS should add the following to your signatures, in the line after CIOPS: code: Those of you in Defense (and those in the 7th OMB or 52nd EFFS for now) should add the following to your signatures, in the line after Defense Wing: code: Everbody, choose your wings, or I'll do it for you. [ 09-28-2004, 01:42 PM: Message edited by: Ben Zwycky ]

Just in case you were getting impatient, Nomad, here is a good article about the domestication of the camel during and before AbrahamÔÇÖs time (the first of the concrete objections I saw listed on the website you linked to) In essence, we have evidence of camel domestication as far back as 2500 BC in the regions surrounding the arabian peninsular, but camel use was not at all widespread in that area until 1100 BC. Domesticated camels were a rarity, only available to the wealthiest in society, to which Abraham certainly belonged. (He was ÔÇ£very rich in livestock, silver and goldÔÇØ (Genesis 13:2) and had 318 men born into his household before having any children of his own (Genesis 14:14) (i.e. 318 male servants, plus their families) Sorry for the shortness of the reply, but IÔÇÖm off on holiday for a week tomorrow and thought IÔÇÖd give you something to chew over before IÔÇÖm off, (and the next post on NT accuracy is taking a lot of research, not sure when thatÔÇÖll be done, especially with my new fleet commitments) Later,

That fleet motto is from way back- I forget who came up with it (I think it may even have been DeSylva) fits well, don't it? I have uploaded the new animated logos (small ones) to my gallery so Nick can download them and put them up on his server (since they can't be properly hosted on my site). When he sends me some ftp info I can put the big ones up on his site directly (they're too big for my ship's site) I'm not sure about the official position on the launch bases, if the other fleets are using their mp ones, then I guess we should too. I was just used to rp where we use the sp ones. Also people should use their ship name in their sig as a link to their ship's website (if they have one) Zane is in charge of CIOPS, I'll handle Defense (which is also in charge of the 7th OMB and 52nd EFFS) until we have people experienced and dedicated enough to run them, unless you wanted to take on something at the moment too, Nick? After that delegation, we'll mainly take care of fleet business, while overseeing the wings. Obviously iss.galcom.net is a great domain name and I'd prefer to be there, but reliability is more important. I'd say put the sig animations up at Nick's domain, but give Remo another week to fix iss.galcom.net (only fair). So, if it's not working by the time I get back (Saturday 18th (I'm leaving tomorrow)) then we'll go with Nick's domain. Nick is in charge for the next 8 days, with Zane as his first assistant. You take care of my baby, now, OK? Later,

looks pretty good to me

OK, animated logos are done (I smoothed out the two sections of the intro animation that were bothering me, resulting in only one extra frame in total, since the files are already insanely large). However, there seems to be a problem with the ftp accounts and the server at iss.galcom.net, so theyÔÇÖre not uploaded (and the old ones are not available). Either we can wait for Remo to get things up and running again, or look for somewhere else to host them. All ISS signatures should follow the structure below: -------------------- Rank and Name Ship name (Type), ISSHQ (Titan/Saturn) ÔÇ£ShipÔÇÖs motto (if you have one)ÔÇØ Wing rank (if you have one) Wing name ÔÇô ISS Fleet Animated Wing Logo (when they become available) Know yourself - Know your enemy - Defend your homeworld (this is the official fleet motto) Those new to the fleet and as yet unassigned to a wing should choose which wing they want to be assigned to. Failure to do so by the end of this month (plenty of time IMO) will result in you being automatically assigned to Defense. Your choices are: Defense Wing (protecting the Sol system from its enemies, both internal and external. Primarily combat and patrol operations, providing tactical support to other Galcom forces, but craft and personnel from Defense can be called upon by CIOPS for individual missions) 7th Orbital Marine Battalion (under the authority of Defense, but also supplies CIOPS with its permanent marine contingents, marines of every category and for every purpose come from here.) 52nd Elite Force Fighter Squadron (also under the authority of Defense. Supplies top-quality fighter pilots and fighter craft to ISS vessels, wings and installations) CIOPS (GalcomÔÇÖs primary intelligence-gathering network, highly classified intelligence and counter-intelligence operations, often works in partnership with wraith fleet,) Until someone earns the privilege of leading Defense Wing, I am taking charge there myself. Those who havenÔÇÖt yet, choose your wings in this thread, then weÔÇÖll update the fleet database and you can start using your official sigs. Any questions?

You're back in the db as wing leader of CIOPS, Zane.

Damier, you have been approved. Welcome aboard!

I am in the process of doing final touches to the animated fleet signature logos. When they are done, we will add them to our signatures. Those belonging to our Marine battalion or Fighter squadron will use the Defense logo in their sigs until they have their own logos (works in progress), since they come under Defense wing.

here, (as if you didn't know )

I have edited my post. No action will be taken against Zane, since the only issue is now settled. I am very happy with his work for the fleet and look forward to working with him in the future. I formally request that he take back his position at the head of CIOPS with full responsibilities. Nick, I look forward to our new arrangement. Let's get making this fleet something to be proud of!

I'll be very sorry to see you go, Nick. You'll forever be on our rolls. Nick, can't you hang on for another couple of weeks? I'm going on holiday for a week next Saturday and will be without internet access. [ 09-07-2004, 03:16 PM: Message edited by: Ben Zwycky ]

Also, the Roman officials mentioned in the gospels were not exactly presented in the most favourable light. King Herod (appointed/approved by Rome) was depicted as a murderous and paranoid powermonger, killing anyone who might be a threat to his rule, (totally agreeing with Josephus assessment of him) and Pontius Pilate as an amoral political opportunist, knowingly condemning an innocent man and releasing the most dangerous kind of political prisoner to save his own political skin, and also as an insensitive murderer (mixing the blood of some Galileans with their sacrifices (Luke 13:1)). Also the early church fathers had no qualms about recording the persecution they suffered from the Roman authorities. If they were trying to soften their stories to avoid offending the Romans, they didnt try very hard. While were on the subject of Pilate, lets look at his behaviour, as that is often used as an objection against the reliability of the gospel accounts. Surely Pilate was a hardheaded, obstinate and violent man who would never let himself be influenced by the Jewish authorities and the crowd, wouldnt he? Lets look at some of the more colourful incidents during Pilates rule, which might shed some light on the matter. First, the famous votive shields incident. Pilate puts up a series of votive shields containing roman insignia in Herods Palace in Jerusalem, highly offending the Jews. Philos record of the events that followed: But when the Jews at large learnt of his action [putting up the shields], which was indeed already widely known, they chose as their spokesman the king's four sons, who enjoyed rank and prestige equal to that of kings, his other descendants, and their own officials, and besought Pilate to undo his innovation in the shape of the shields, and not to violate their native customs, which had hitherto been invariably preserved inviolate by kings and emperors alike. When Pilate, who was a man of inflexible, stubborn, and cruel disposition, obstinately refused, they shouted, "Do not cause a revolt! Do not cause a war! Do not break the peace! Disrespect done to our ancient laws brings no honor to the emperor. Do not make Tiberius an excuse for insulting our nation. He does not want any of our traditions done away with. If you say that he does, show us some decree or letter or something of the sort, so that we may cease troubling you and appeal to our master by means of an embassy." This last remark exasperated Pilate most of all, for he was afraid that if they really sent an embassy, they would bring accusations against the rest of his administration as well, specifying in detail his venality, his violence, his thefts, his assaults, his abusive behavior, his frequent executions of untried prisoners, and his endless savage ferocity...When the Jewish officials...realized that Pilate was regretting what he had done, although he did not wish to show it, they wrote a letter to Tiberius, pleading their cause as forcibly as they could. What words, what threats Tiberius uttered against Pilate when he read it! It would be superfluous to describe his anger, since his reaction speaks for itself. For immediately, without even waiting for the next day, he wrote to Pilate, reproaching and rebuking him a thousand times for his new-fangled audacity and telling him to remove the shields at once and have them taken from the capital..." OK, here we have: Pilate seriously offends the Jews They report him to his boss (all the way to the top, two levels above him) Despite the protection of his patron Sejanus in Rome, he is very harshly rebuked by the emperor. Any politician with any grain of sense would have learned from this experience, but just in case this wasnt enough for someone as hardheaded as Pilate, it gets worse. In AD 31 Sejanus was removed from office for conspiring against the emperor. That kind of thing is no good for your job security, or for anyone closely linked with you. That event would still be very fresh in the emperors memory in AD 33, the most likely date for Jesus crucifixion. This would multiply Tiberias readiness to believe any accusations of disloyalty (which was quite high to start with) and to punish him very harshly (ending his career and probably life as well). So when the accusation came repeatedly If you let this man go, you are no friend of Caesar. Anyone who claims to be a king opposes Caesar. (John 19:13 (NIV)) Pilate was in trouble and knew it. Taking these events into account, his behaviour as recorded in the Gospels seems a whole lot more believable.

Another objection was that the Roman Empire under Constantine substantially changed the New Testament documents as a tool to subdue the population. To examine this point, lets look at some of the existing manuscripts that have been dated significantly before the 4th Century (and Constantine) The Beatty papyri. The major papyri in this collection are p45, p46, p47. * p45: 150-250ad; contains some (or all) of Mt 20, 21, 25, 26; Mr 4-9, 11-12; Lk 6-7, 9-14; Jn 10-11; Acts 4-17. * p46: 90-175ad; contains some (or all) of Rom 5-6, 8-16; all of I & II Cor, Gal, Eph., Philp., Col, I Thess 1,2,5; all of Hebrews. * p47: third century, contains Revelation 9:10-17.2 The Bodmer papyri The major papyri in this collection are p66, p72, p75. * p66: 150-200 AD, contains almost all of the Gospel of John * p72: 200's, containing all of I & II Peter, Jude * p75: 175-200 AD, contains most of Luke 3-18, 22-24; John 1-15. The Text of the New Testament, Aland and Aland, Eerdmans/EJ Brill: 1989, page 85: We cannot conclude this survey of the papyri without some further comments on the truly amazing discoveries of the past generation. The critical significance of p52, which preserves only a fragment of John 18, lies in the date of 'about 125' assigned to it by the leading papyrologists. Although 'about 125' allows for leeway of about twenty-five years on either side, the consensus has come in recent years to regard 125 as representing the later limit, so that p52 must have been copied very soon after the Gospel of John was itself written in the early 90's A.D. (with the recent discovery of p90 another second century fragment of the Gospel of John is now known). It provides a critical witness to the quality of the New Testament textual tradition, further confirming it by exhibiting a 'normal text', i.e., attesting the text of today (that of Nestle-Aland26 and GNT3). While it is true that papyri from the third century were known before the discovery of the Chester Beatty papyri, none of them was as early as p46, which contains the Pauline letters and has been dated 'about 200' (with some leeway on either side). But more significantly, all the early papyri known previously contain no more than a few verses of the New Testament text, with the exception of p15 from the third century which preserves almost a whole leaf. Now for the first time entire New Testament writings became available from the early period. OK, so we have a lot of the New Testament contained in documents before the 4th Century. How much has been changed? Same book, page 87: The implications of Papyrus Bodmer XIV/XV (p75) of the gospels of Luke and John went even further. Written somewhat later (than p66), at the beginning of the third century, it comprised twenty-seven almost perfectly preserved sheets together with a part of their binding. This papyrus marked another revolution in our understanding of how the New Testament text developed: its text proved to be so close to that of Codex Vaticanus ( that the theory of recensions, i.e., of thoroughgoing revisions of the New Testament text made in the fourth century, was no longer defensible. One of the main pillars supporting the dominant theory of New Testament textual history was now demolished. Also we have numerous copies of early church sermons and letters containing quotations from virtually the whole of the New Testament from which we are able to reconstruct almost all the original documents, and the differences are insignificant from the versions used in modern translations. Hmm This is not to say that nobody tried to make some alterations at a later stage, but we have at those points so many other manuscripts that those alterations can be easily spotted and rejected.

Well Jerold Keenan last posted two weeks ago (post #9 in the fleet organization thread) so I wouldn't delete him just yet (unless Jerold Ryan Keenan is someone else, but that'd be a weird coincidence.)

OK, that is a whole 'nother load of issues, which I (or someone else) will have to get round to eventually, but the discussion so far was about the New Testament, and there's still a long way to go. I apologise if this is too slow for you, but I'm only one man with limited time and resources, you know

and I was beginning to think no-one was reading I was thrown a little as well, to start with, which shook me out of my laziness and forced me to go and do some research on the particular issues raised.