Guest Soviet Posted July 30, 2003 Report Posted July 30, 2003 In honour of Derek Smart's efforts to make a great space rpg/adventure. I have done my best to compile the most Detailed, itemised tech support problem report. Also please don't reply unless you are a winxp user or somebody from 3000ad. (Is there anything more tedious then trawling through these threads for tech info just to see personal comments making it even longer?) This is a detailed problem with WinXP Pro. (all patched) NOTE: my DirectX is 9.0a NOT 9.0 in the systems profile (there was no option for 9.0a). This massive tech report is a direct result of a crazy amount of uninstalls and installs (o and loads of frustration). Thx 2 the forum I have tried everything including the things mentioned in topics like delmrr's topic "Patching Problems". Everyone in delmrr's thread who had a problem 1) Didn't mention winxp or not until later on in the thread. or 2) Had no system profile. Annoying to say the least. Ok so when I fresh install the game to my usual games folder: C:Program FilesExtrasGamesBattlecruiser Millennium Gold NOTE: the following options a) or failed to be mentioned in the patch probs thread or mentioned in the patch readme. It installs fine, when I a) install for anyone who uses this computer (all users) or when I just install for me (Soviet). I will refer to these later on as (a) and (. It also updates my registry like it should and under HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE/software/3000ad/Battlecruiser Millennium Gold/path it notes the path as C:Program FilesExtrasGamesBattlecruiser Millennium Gold which is correct. The problem applying patch: I put the file into this folder (the one within which my battlecruiser game lies) C:Program FilesExtrasGamesBattlecruiser Millennium Gold When I install for others (a) the patch has the wrong path so I input a different path directing it to install into C:Program FilesExtrasGamesBattlecruiser Millennium Gold It chugs along and "patches" it. Only it doesn't. What it does do is: edit my shortcut "join mp server" and edits out the /c (like its supposed to) then apparently it proceeded to change my registry settings under HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE/software/3000ad/Battlecruiser Millenium Gold/path and put of all things, the wrong path: C:Program FilesDreamcatcher3000adBattlecruiser Millennium Gold. Then apparently it put everything from the patch in that folder which it creates. It also edited registry: HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINESOFTWAREMicrosoftWindowsCurrentVersionSharedDLLs and added 1) C:Program FilesDreamCatcher3000ADBattlecruiser Millennium Golddocsappendixairdefense2.html 2) C:Program FilesDreamCatcher3000ADBattlecruiser Millennium Golddocsappendiximagesmapsgalaxy_map_links_ia1.jpg 3) C:Program FilesDreamCatcher3000ADBattlecruiser Millennium Goldgfxavidclogo.avi 4) C:Program FilesDreamCatcher3000ADBattlecruiser Millennium Goldgfxfrontendinterface.zip NOTE: obviously they were wrong. Or from its point of view right as thats the new location for these files. Then when I try installing it only for me ( it installs right proper. Wwhen I get to patching, the patch itself (unlike before) actually has the *correct* path (C:Program FilesExtrasGamesBattlecruiser Millennium Gold) already, (note: I have both left it as is AND redirected it to the right folder) so patching we go: it works fine only now the "killfile.exe" runs, hey thats new. the registry reads as it should *EXCEPT* where the version is listed still as 1.00.40 under HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINESOFTWARE3000adBattlecruiser Millennium Goldversion. The shortcut for join mp is *NOT* edited to remove the /c and the bcsetup.ini still reads as version 1.00.40. Now I have checked and it has updated my .exe judging by the smaller size and different date. If you are about to ask the following: 1) Why a different path? have you tried the original path? yes the results from my second example occur, only the path being different. 2)In your final example can you edit your registry version number along with the bcsetup.ini to read 1.00.01 and have it read/work properly? yup. 3)Have you tried copying the patch files over the ones in your directory? yup. 4) Did it ever patch properly? Here's the killer answer. YES. But only once, I have no idea what I did differently. I think maybe the stars were in alignment and the game knew I needed to play it bad or else I was going to toss it. Also if your sub-question was: Why the hell did you uninstall it when it worked? There was a problem where i could no longer login when i was docked it would ctd at any base, right when i clicked "login", I would reload saves and logout fine.. I could go to any base and login and ctd. I figured a reinstall might fix it. Not to mention the fact that the game for some reason in another save, stopped playing music and no amount of tinkering could get it to play the music again. So uninstalling I went. This is waaay more then just a concern. It's a fundamental problem with the way the patch functions. I can work around it but why do i have to? And god help someone with less patience/will to play the game patched. If there's a solution, by all means tell me. If there isn't one, please on your next patch fix it. please. Anyways thx to those who respond. BTW if it weren't The Underdogs I never would have gotten hooked on this game. Finally I have a fix for my Frontier: Elite II (David Braben) needs, for those of you who remember Elite on the Amiga or elsewhere: finally more engaging space games! Yay Derek Smart!
Dambreville Posted July 31, 2003 Report Posted July 31, 2003 Sweet, thanks for writing a report Soviet! I was having the same problem which I stated in the other post and the only thing I could think of is was it being WinXP Pro. This is a problem and I knew it is because I DO take care of my computer and do what the troubleshooting files say. Nothing has worked except for what I did. One more question, but I think this is a Radeon 7500 specific video driver issue... do planets flicker for you at all Soviet (before or after patching)?
Guest Soviet Posted July 31, 2003 Report Posted July 31, 2003 The only time planets ever "flicker" or for that matter, in my case, disappear altogether is when I switch between apps./minimise or alt-tab/alt-esc. But then it's not recommended or supported I do that, so I don't do it anymore. If you don't do that, then it's something else. (possibly for another topic if there isn't one already.) Sorry if i couldn't be more help.
Supreme Cmdr Posted July 31, 2003 Report Posted July 31, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Soviet: Thx 2 the forum I have tried everything including the things mentioned in topics like delmrr's topic "Patching Problems".And WHY exactly did you decide to create a new topic when one - related to patching - already exists? quote:It installs fine, when I a) install for anyone who uses this computer (all users) or when I just install for me (Soviet). I will refer to these later on as (a) and (....and the problem is what? quote:When I install for others (a) the patch has the wrong path so I input a different path directing it to install into C:Program FilesExtrasGamesBattlecruiser Millennium GoldNo. The patch does NOT have the wrong path. It is looking for - and will ONLY use - the DEFAULT path used by the original game install. Quoted from Installshield docs According to Windows logo requirements, you must install your application's files to a subfolder of the Program Files folder, regardless of the language of the target system. If you use ProgramFilesFolder as the parent folder for your product's Destination Folder property, your files will be installed to the correct location. The initial value for this property is [ProgramFilesFolder][product name]. By the time the next patch is due, I will contact Installshield to see if there is a workaround for this (for those of you who insist on installing the game elsewhere other than the default). quote:It chugs along and "patches" it. Only it doesn't.It won't patch files it cannot find. And since you did not install to the default folder, nothing will happen. quote:What it does do is: edit my shortcut "join mp server" and edits out the /c (like its supposed to)Shortcuts are not propaged from the game install folder. They are desktop properties - which means they are unaffected by this. quote:it works fine only now the "killfile.exe" runs, hey thats new.It runs because it is designed to clean up files that are no longer required by the new version. quote:4) Did it ever patch properly? Here's the killer answer. YES. But only once, I have no idea what I did differently. I think maybe the stars were in alignment and the game knew I needed to play it bad or else I was going to toss it.No, its got nothing to do with stars. Don't go pissing around with it and it will work just fine. Just like it was designed to. quote:This is waaay more then just a concern. It's a fundamental problem with the way the patch functions. I can work around it but why do i have to? And god help someone with less patience/will to play the game patched.There is NOTHING wrong with the patch. Period.
Guest Soviet Posted July 31, 2003 Report Posted July 31, 2003 Fights the urge to be rude and instead settles for *rubs temples* KILLING YOU WITH MY MIND! On the off chance i was unsuccessful here goes: First i started a new topic because the point was lost in the first one which was i believe that delmrr is an idiot for not reading everything.. My topic is completely different from his. And I have a better, more topical, title for those just passing by. Ok so now that we know I have read and done everything. Why can't you read everything. If you read the middle of my message quote: 1) Why a different path? have you tried the original path? yes the results from my second example occur, only the path being different. Note second example follows: quote: Then when I try installing it only for me ( it installs right proper. Wwhen I get to patching, the patch itself (unlike before) actually has the *correct* path (C:Program FilesExtrasGamesBattlecruiser Millennium Gold) already, (note: I have both left it as is AND redirected it to the right folder) so patching we go: it works fine only now the "killfile.exe" runs, hey thats new. the registry reads as it should *EXCEPT* where the version is listed still as 1.00.40 under HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINESOFTWARE3000adBattlecruiser Millennium Goldversion. The shortcut for join mp is *NOT* edited to remove the /c and the bcsetup.ini still reads as version 1.00.40. Now I have checked and it has updated my .exe judging by the smaller size and different date. U see o great overlord It won't install even into the **DEFAULT** directory.. and it's not just me.. Here lemme spell it out for you if the installshield on the main game works why the frell does the installshield for the patch not work the same way? And don't just say it does.. because it doesn't! Cripes we don't write these things for fun you know. there's a real problem here. Which i believe is in the patch (almost 100%) in regards to winxp pro. possibly something to with the install settings initially used for multiple users.. why else would they install differently? o and quote: No. The patch does NOT have the wrong path. It is looking for - and will ONLY use - the DEFAULT path used by the original game install. is 100% wrong when i just gave examples (that I can repeat) of it not doing *exactly* that. And quote: Quoted from Installshield docs According to Windows logo requirements, you must install your application's files to a subfolder of the Program Files folder, regardless of the language of the target system. If you use ProgramFilesFolder as the parent folder for your product's Destination Folder property, your files will be installed to the correct location. The initial value for this property is [ProgramFilesFolder][product name]. Well thats wonderful too bad you didn't even follow this rule: as in C:Program FilesDreamcatcher3000adBattlecruiser Millennium Gold Last I heard "Battlecruiser Millennium Gold" was the product name. and as an aside where u used dreamcatcher ( i used "extras") and where u used 3000ad (i used "games") so there we have it we are both 2 directories away from product name. And saying "Because you aren't doing x right. Read y." where x is some step. and y is something on the site or in a readme or on disc or in the actual manual. I have *read* it and followed it's instructions. So thats just a cop-out or just plain bs. So please trust me. L8r P.S. quote: By the time the next patch is due, I will contact Installshield to see if there is a workaround for this (for those of you who insist on installing the game elsewhere other than the default howzabout you also ask them about the *default* as well cause there's the problem. p.s.s. if i did manage to kill him with my mind, i offer my condolences to his family and friends.
Thomas Siemens Posted July 31, 2003 Report Posted July 31, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Soviet: And quote: Quoted from Installshield docs According to Windows logo requirements, you must install your application's files to a subfolder of the Program Files folder, regardless of the language of the target system. If you use ProgramFilesFolder as the parent folder for your product's Destination Folder property, your files will be installed to the correct location. The initial value for this property is [ProgramFilesFolder][product name]. Well thats wonderful too bad you didn't even follow this rule: as in C:Program FilesDreamcatcher3000adBattlecruiser Millennium Gold Last I heard "Battlecruiser Millennium Gold" was the product name. and as an aside where u used dreamcatcher ( i used "extras") and where u used 3000ad (i used "games") so there we have it we are both 2 directories away from product name.That's hair splitting BS! If you edit the installation path during the actual installation, you are on your own. Quite simple, isn't it? The recommended way to apply patches is to copy the patch file to your game directory, whereever it lives. Then do the patch, and everything will be nicely found, and get patched. It's in the Troubleshooting FAQ for years IIRC! Oh, and some free hint: Don't mess with the boss! Best regards
Guest Soviet Posted July 31, 2003 Report Posted July 31, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Gudihl: That's hair splitting BS! If you edit the installation path during the actual installation, you are on your own. Quite simple, isn't it? edit or no edit she doesn't work captain! quote:The recommended way to apply patches is to copy the patch file to your game directory, whereever it lives. Then do the patch, and everything will be nicely found, and get patched. It's in the Troubleshooting FAQ for years IIRC! Oh, and some free hint: Don't mess with the boss! Best regards Gee that was helpful someone else who didn't read the thread.. yes i did that along with a whole host of other things! the default install path *DOES* *NOT* *WORK*.. good god.. Lates P.S. I don't mean to sound snarky but.. Thanks for pointing out something i read already. sheesh. Nothing personal, but constructive help is what i am after. For those who don't have time to follow the long messages above here's a recap all done on a winXP PRO. system: 1) install game to default path C:Program FilesDreamCatcher3000ADBattlecruiser Millennium Gold 2) put bcmg101.exe in that game folder 3) install patch to default path C:Program FilesDreamCatcher3000ADBattlecruiser Millennium Gold 4) watch as it doesnt work 5) try other ideas 6) read everything 7) try those ideas 8) construct an itemised report and post it. 9) watch as people don't read all of it. 10) be frustrated when they pick out the non-relevant parts to talk about or they treat you like the town idiot. 11) do a recap. 12) Keep telling em the world is round.
Spindoktor Posted July 31, 2003 Report Posted July 31, 2003 I'm sure you are just trying to be witty but that style doesn't work here. Imagine you are in a USMC boot camp and you just arrived. Good luck.
Bandus Posted July 31, 2003 Report Posted July 31, 2003 Jesus christ! My only question is, is there a gun big enough for this job? :starts playing "Taps":
Guest Soviet Posted July 31, 2003 Report Posted July 31, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Spindoktor: I'm sure you are just trying to be witty but that style doesn't work here. Imagine you are in a USMC boot camp and you just arrived. Good luck. How is this or the above helpful? If you don't like me or my style please post in general discussions somewhere. Title it "Soviets an ass." Now in an attempt to keep the topic on track I have done some digging at installshields site and elsewhere. Various versions apparently have a bit of a problem with winXP: example I will use is star trek: birth of the federation circa 1999 where the patch (or installshield, as we know its not the patch or bcmg that has anything to do with the problem) only really worked on win 98. The game company got bought and sold off. So when winXP came along noone cared company wise to fix this underground cult game so the community fixed it. Anyways hopefully this helps get my point across. Which is that there's a problem.
OvermindDL1 Posted July 31, 2003 Report Posted July 31, 2003 I use WinXP Pro, I have BCMG installed to H:Program FilesDreamcatcheretc.. etc.. etc.. no that is not the windows program files dir. and yes BCMG works fine, patches install fine, therefore something must be wrong on your end, not the program.
Spindoktor Posted July 31, 2003 Report Posted July 31, 2003 quote: How is this or the above helpful? It was only helpful if you chose to heed my words, which apparently you didn't. Suit yourself.
Gallion Posted July 31, 2003 Report Posted July 31, 2003 Flames off gentlemen! ALCON have been warned If you don't like the style - don't post. If you think that this is all BS - don't post. If you don't like Soviet - don't post. Bottom line: You don't have to post. Topic reopened. TTFN [ 07-31-2003, 06:58 PM: Message edited by: Gallion ]
Supreme Cmdr Posted July 31, 2003 Report Posted July 31, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Soviet: Well thats wonderful too bad you didn't even follow this rule: as in C:Program FilesDreamcatcher3000adBattlecruiser Millennium Gold Last I heard "Battlecruiser Millennium Gold" was the product name. No, whats wonderful is your obvious ignorance. I am a programmer and I know what a literal value, in this case [ProductName] is. It is basically the path TO the product. I can put that path anywhere I bloody well like. Just like all other games which install games in a folder which is the parent of the publisher. In this case Dreamcatcher. And because Dreamcatcher has other products by other developers who use this path, I added 3000AD in order to further differentiate our products so that they all (e.g. BCG) go in our own 3000AD tree. Now, get the hell off my site!
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