Should America have Contributed more to Tsunami disaster?

[LostInSpace]

Most of the countries on this planet hate and despise America. Don't fool yourself into thinking they don't. All of a sudden these countries cry when America is stingy with it's money in relief. I say it's time for other countries to take this up for a while. They should be thankful we offered anything.

Clicky on this to see an un-offical poll

(CNN) -- -- The United States will increase its aid pledge from $35 million to $350 million to help victims of the tsunamis in south Asia, CNN has learned.

What's your opinion?

[Guest Remo Williams]

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In other words: in pure $ terms, the US donations are the biggest. However, proportionally to its wealth, the US is the country who make the smallest effort.

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There's reason for that and I think the rest of the world should know why without it being spelled out.

The US is starting to relise who our friends are and aren't. Go figure no matter what we do someone is going whine and complain So why do anything for a world that hates you for your position and success. For decades we've given unbelievable amounts in assistance and the blood of our own just to have them spit in our face.

[LostInSpace]

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Originally posted by nomad:

Draw your own conclusions and please, stop to give either partial infos and/or forget about context and the principle of proportionality.

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I'm just starting. If I gave up everything in the first post, I'll have a lot less to follow up with.

[Darkling]

Let's see, most of these people want us dead, but now that they're dying, we have to rush in with all that we've got? When our friends need our help we pull out all the stops, when our enemy's need our help, well we help them out too, we just don't pull out all the stops, Period. I don't think there's anything wrong with that.

Also, things in the US work a little differently than in other countries, In most other country's the people expect the government to act, then they go about their business, I think that you will see that private donations and assistance in the U.S. will far exceed not only all other governments and their private donations put together, but also it will exceed all assistance that you will see from the U.S. Government itself. U.S. Citizens are inherently a very generous people.

[LostInSpace]

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Originally posted by Darkling:

.....but also it will exceed all assistance that you will see from the U.S. Government itself. U.S. Citizens are inherently a very generous people.

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Agreed, and there-in lies the problem I think. Because we are able to do such things and most of them can't could it be possible that that's what leads to the anger towards American's and America itself. It probably started off as jealousy, and turned into anger/hatred somewhere along the line.

[Supreme Cmdr]

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Originally posted by LostInSpace:

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Originally posted by Darkling:

.....but also it will exceed all assistance that you will see from the U.S. Government itself. U.S. Citizens are inherently a very generous people.

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Agreed, and there-in lies the problem I think. Because we are able to do such things and most of them can't could it be possible that that's what leads to the anger towards American's and America itself. It probably started off as jealousy, and turned into anger/hatred somewhere along the line.

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Absolutely.

[Guest Remo Williams]

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So, may you explain me where you get from this distorted perception of the significance of the US on the international scene as aid donor ?

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Distorted umm, come now some would say your perception of world affairs is distorted, but I won't since no ones perception is distorted it is simply their perception and not to be judge by another by their standards.

If what you believe works for you fine run with it, but don't think people will believe what you say because you happen to believe it and obtained this position from whatever source you believe to be true. Deception runs ramped so your truth is seen as and out right lie to other who have a different perception of the world. To see other as distorted is to believe you are better than and above others. Which is close to arrogance that is supposed to be an American trait. I guess we donÔÇÖt corner the market after all.

[Wolferz]

Put the fingers back in your pockets please.

This "My daddy is better" debate, that six year old children are prone to engage in grows tiresome.

No man is without sin and since the governments of the world are made up of many men, logic would dictate that these governments are no better than the men who suppose to run them.

Charity, mercy and compassion for our neighbors has always been the shining foundation of the American people.

Unfortunately there are those within our governing body who take it upon themselves to lend aid where and when it suits "them", with or without the consent of the peoples of our land.

Many travesties have befallen different peoples around the globe over the centuries. What makes today any different?... Global Media that's what.

It seems that charity is forgotten in the blink of an eye and charity from America is forgotten in a splicket-(half of a New York second).

There are so many unique individuals populating our planet and I detest the very idea that even one of them should suffer any calamity to home and hearth, be it natural or man made.

Isn't it funny how everyone passes the tin cup in our direction after every natural disaster?

Could this be because we have always been there when our neighbors were in dire straits?

Has the world grown so accustomed to it, that it is now expected of us?

How many disasters has America suffered through while the world turned a blind eye?

And now they're going to snipe about what we're putting in this latest cup?

We send food, clothing, equipment and medical supplies after every disaster on the planet, no matter what country it occurs in, no matter what affiliations that country's government has with ours, no matter what religion their peoples practice, no matter if yesterday, these people were burning our flag in the streets that they are now floating in today.

Maybe it's time for the world to wake up and smell the coffee.To pull their collective heads out of their collective asses and give props to those who give freely and expect nothing in return except to Pay it forward,

[Guest]

I believe that the US Federal Government should NOT give any aid of ANY sort to ANY country ANTWHERE.

THe constitution does not allow the Federal Government to give ANY tax money for benevolent purposes of ANY sort.

Every time the Federal government gives aid money to anyone for any purpose, they spit on the constitution.

Therefore, not only should we cut off ALL aid to any victims anywhere, we should also cut off ALL aid to anyone for any purpose by the Federal government.

If the people on the other hand wish to contribute voluntarily, then private orgnaizations can do whatever they wish.

SO, I disagree with ALL of you, the Federal government should not be giving ANY aid of ANY sort to ANYONE.

[Kalshion]

Nomad, you claim the US isn't putting much effert

And you find that surprising?

Who the hell came to the United State's AID when the Twin Towers where hit, 3000 people died... WHO came to OUR aid when that occured?!

NO ONE!

So that should asnswer you're question why we are reluctant in providing aid

But, if you truely wanna know why we are the only one's who can handle these situations is becuase of this, we have:

THE RESOURCES

THE MAN POWER

THE MONEY

THE PEOPLE

THE EXPERIENCE

to handle such a situation

In that light, I believe we shouldn't aid anyone.. they never helped us

We now know who our REAL allie's are

Yes we have the charity groups here that tend to help out, but most of them are money grabbers and don't care about the people who they are suppose to help

Thats why we send in the military to do the dirty work because there the only people who we can truely relie on to handle these situations

As much as I am for helping other people (since it's my character) I do not believe we should be lending any aid, what so ever, in this disaster

Sorry to take this off topic Remo if I did, but just had to point out these facts

[TARWMSRK]

I do believe that nobody should complain about the aid they get as long as they are getting some. But we SHOULD lend out aid to other countries to situations like this. Did we really need aid when the WTC went down? Did we really need aid when we went into Iraq? Hell no we did not-- we are more than capable of doing these things ourselves and would probably be better off doing it ourselves as foreign aid would just end up getting in the way. I guess its just me but every time I look at the political forums, America seems more like the evil empire instead of the kind 'big brothers' that we should be.

Though I wouldnt blame any country for looking out for its own interests... Its too high maintiance to help out the rest of the world (though its done anyway).

[Kalshion]

Nomad, I really tire of you calling me "very young" just becuase I have a different opinion than you... please stop

If those people decided to live on the shour line's, then thats there choice, they knew the risks. Just like living on the side of the mountain that could abruptly crumble one day without warning

And yes Nomad, both of these events do coincide with each other

This event caused deaths, and occured without warning

The last event caused deaths, and occured without warning

Although both where caused by different means, they still resulted in the same thing: Death

For most countrys, when a disaster for them occur's they come running with there tails tucked between there legs for US AID

So, I still stand by my previous statement. The government shouldn't be giving ANY AID WHAT SO EVER since it doesn't help us in the least

PR? Bah, yea, more like Negative PR... the more we help the more "evil" we become in the eyes of the other "nations"

In that since, I really wish we would go back to being an isolation nation... it served us VERY well before WW2

[ 01-04-2005, 01:48 PM: Message edited by: Kalshion ]

[Kalshion]

Registration again Nomad..... please provide a link to a non-registration site

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Well since the US pissed off the entire Arab nation, it was only a matter of time before an terrorist attack.

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And that was justification to murder 3000 INNOCENTS?

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Or

Real bad for those guys in Iraq, but hey, your in the army, donÔÇÖt count on my sympathy

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When you join the military, you take an oath, and by that oath you follow orders. For example, my sister is in the military, she knows the risk's, she know's she'll die one of these days... maybe on the battlefield or of natural cause's, but-

AT LEAST SHE HAS THE GUTS TO DEFEND THIS COUNTRY! Unlike some people who I can name here

Although, I feel for every death in our military, but thats because I don't know what they go through, but I do know that they are trying there hardest

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Give me a break, how many times does this have to be said, the US is not the biggest benefactor in the world PERIOD. Give me some FACTS that prove otherwise.

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FACTS are all over the net, use you're hands and SEARCH

The ONLY reason this world hasn't fallen apart is because the US donate's more money to each country than any other nation, sorry but the poll's are incorrect due to WHO does those polls (like the one's done by the liberal media here in the US)

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Well I think the rest of the world would welcome that idea, the USs no more meddling in everyoneÔÇÖs affairs.

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About time we agree, but then again, without the US.. countrys like Japan, Korea, ENGLAND, Isreal, Aust and several other's would fall apart in under 10 years perhaps even 5

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Well DUH, its not supposed to help you, but its supposed to help the people over there. And secondly: Do you think they just give a bag of money; ÔÇ£Here ya go, twenty million dollarsÔÇØ. Ofcourse not, they say, well rebuild your port, wich costs twenty million dollars by an American/European company. So it does help you.

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Uh huh, honestly, the US should work on itself than other nations. We have our own problems that we need to correct before we should help others

This is getting to become off topic, time to get back on topic

Anyone know the current numbers for contributions?

[Kalshion]

Blasted edit time

here =D

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,143271,00.html

Also, for the record, the use has donated 350m

One more thing.. where are all the muslim donations?

[Guest]

AGAIN I say, the FEDERAL government should not be giving ANY tax payer money for aid relief.

I say again, NONE, PERIOD!!!

The constitution does NOT allow the federal government to give our tax money away for aid of ANY sort.

If the president wants to get behind a private Donation drive, more power to him, but the federal government should not be giving anyone, ANY aid of ANY sort, for ANY purpose.

[Cc]

You are an idiot!!!

Screw Off.

[Kalshion]

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Originally posted by Cc:

You are an idiot!!!

Screw Off.

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He didn't just say that ... right?

[LostInSpace]

I guess Sri Lanka doesn't need that much help after all BBC: Sri Lanka rejects Israel rescuers .

[Cc]

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Originally posted by LostInSpace:

I guess Sri Lanka doesn't need that much help after all

BBC: Sri Lanka rejects Israel rescuers

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Spoken as a true conserative.

Hey...this isn't politcal.People are suffering over there.

[LostInSpace]

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Originally posted by Cc:

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Originally posted by LostInSpace:

I guess Sri Lanka doesn't need that much help after all

BBC: Sri Lanka rejects Israel rescuers

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1:Spoken as a true conserative.

2:Hey...this isn't politcal.People are suffering over there.

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1: Conservatism has nothing to do with this.

2: Exactly, so why did Sri Lanka do what it did? Apparently even in their national emergency they can still pull these things. Why? Because of the island's Muslim minority which is only 7%.

Anyway as a follow up:

Pay special attention to what Annan says.

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CNN:'Core group' defended

He (Powell) also insisted that the U.S. creation of a "core group" -- the United States, India, Japan and Australia -- to respond to the crisis was not an effort to undermine the United Nations.

"What we have tried to do is use the core group ... as a way of getting started, recognizing that it would ultimately be subsumed into the efforts of the United Nations," he said.

Egeland praised the core group and said it was "helping" the United Nations.

Powell has said the United States may add to its $350 million pledge, and he told CNN the figure does not cover the total U.S. contribution.

"Our Department of Defense is spending tens of millions of dollars more as we dispatched two carrier groups, a regular big aircraft carrier group and a Marine amphibious group to the region," he said. "And private donations are significant."

But there are also questions about whether the United States will follow through with the promised contribution. A year ago, an earthquake destroyed the Iranian city of Bam, and the United States has not sent all the money it promised at the time.

"When we pledge an amount, we plan to deliver that amount," said Powell. "Sometimes there are difficulties with respect to the actual delivery of resources. In a place like Iran, that might be particularly difficult."

He added, "Not all of the money is spent immediately. ... The money fans out over a period of time in a sensible way, not all at once."

Annan said international pledges following disasters are regularly unfulfilled.

"This is the major problem we have. It's a classic problem we have with all these humanitarian issues," he told ABC's "This Week with George Stephanopoulos."

Annan said he hopes that "given the fact that this is really an international crisis," with numerous countries having lost citizens, that the promised responses will come through.

It's not clear precisely where the promised U.S. funds will come from, but Powell rejected a suggestion from Leahy that at least some come from funds earmarked for Iraq reconstruction.

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Here's the entire article:

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Before leaving Sunday on a U.S. mission to tsunami-ravaged southern Asia, Secretary of State Colin Powell sharply rebutted criticism that the initial U.S. response to the disaster was slow and inadequate.

[ 01-04-2005, 09:56 PM: Message edited by: LostInSpace ]

[Cc]

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Exactly, so why did Sri Lanka do what it did? Apparently even in their national emergency they can still pull these things.

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Don't know why....but that should not change how we respond as a nation, or as individual people.

[Soback]

Don't even bother replying to Cc, it's doubtfull he will last another 24 hours on this boards.

And yes, Jaguar is damn right. My tax money should stay INSIDE US. If individuals want to send aid, that's up to them. Why is the government making a donation on my behalf? Hey they rejected help from Israel, well, maybe there's people here who want to reject aid to them, but have no choice because it was decided for them by the government and the donation was forcibly taken out of their taxes.

And to nomad. US donated the most, Europe and France is right there on the bottom, if you want to count strict numbers. But if you want to count by comparison to the size of the economy. Here's my answer. You know why cells can only get so big? It has something to do with simple math, as the cell grows it's surface area starts exceeding it's cube area, which means it can't get rid of waste, and it takes more energy to support itself. The ratio goes up exponentially. Therefore, US has bigger economy, and it takes more of that economy to put money back into US. But all that aside, I've said it a million times. I (US) don't own anyone, anything. Nothing, not a single thing. And the government shouldn't be contributing on my behalf without consulting me on how to spend my taxes, but they did. So they (Sri lanka) and the world should take that aid and shut up, because frankly US citizens are getting tired of all this, and no, the world (especially europe) can't sustain itself without US. So take it as a fact, and live with it. Be happy US gave help, and be thankful that we gave the most help, (or we could've contributed like france did, a couple of hundred thousand $, ROFL, that's just insulting, but I don't see them complaining about that), and if they are so hard up for help like Cc said, then they shouldn't have turned down Israels help.

A little bit of wishfull thinking would be for US to withdraw all help, from everywhere, and just be it's own pure nationalistic, capitalistic country. See how the world starts singing then...

[ 01-04-2005, 10:35 PM: Message edited by: Soback ]

[Cc]

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Don't even bother replying to Cc, it's doubtfull he will last another 24 hours on this boards

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Maybe.....maybe not.

Don't know.

[Cc]

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why is the government making a donation on my behalf?

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That's why we have a central government.If it was up to every individual how money was spent nothing would get done.

[Guest]

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Originally posted by Cc:

You are an idiot!!!

Screw Off.

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I hope you weren't talking to me....

Because if you were, it shows exactly who the idiot is in this little soiree.

Read the constitution, and the federalist and the anti federalist papers, and NAME me ONE spot, ONE line that allows the federal government to give OUR tax dollars for benevolent purposes.

Show me just one....

Then, tell me who the idiot is....