Supreme Cmdr

Timeline corrected, thanks

Let me explain a little about why, as far I'm concerned, BCM will be the final single-player BC3K title. Go look at the version control file for BC3K v2.0. In doing that, count the number of bug fixes and enhancements. You will see that even though the game has been released 3 times and by 3 different distributors worldwide, up until the final v2.09 version, I continued to put in enhancements - without getting a dime for those enhancements. So, think about this. I can BC:3020AD (which I've pretty much done, but is not yet official) and focus its content on BC Online. Then, it gets released as a $45 retail product, maybe with an offline ACM scenario (dunno) for practicing only. Not much gameplay there, if any. Then, you log on to www.galcom.net (which was just registered 3 days ago btw), register and pay, say, $10/month or $110/year to log on and play. Of course, you'll get the regular glitch fixes, but, you will also get the pleasure of probably getting enhancements each time you log on to play. New galaxy, models, play modes, scenarios etc. Since I control the servers, what Asheron's Call is currently doing by having gamers play against a storyline, is child's play compared to what BC3K already offers by way of a dynamic universe. Sure, we could have a primary world wide war scenario running for a certain period in which all manner of race and caste entities, engage in combat, trade, diplomacy, alliances etc - on planets, in space, in ships, in vehicles (space, land, sea, air) in first person mode (space, planet) etc. And then one day, I upload an augmented script that, say, a new galaxy has been discovered, rip for the picking or say a mission profile for a massive fleet attack etc. For one thing, all those RPG stories that you are reading about, can be played and re-enacted in the game world, without any scripting whatsoever. eg if Tac and his gang of misfits decide they're going to take on Rattler and his entrenched minions in Rinaal, all they have to do is long and do it. Of course, if Rattler and his crew aren't online, they can always rely on the kick-ass AI to handle the defense of their station etc. And if all GALCOM members collectively gain enough money, they can build another starstation or starbase, where they feel like. Even the very act of objects being destroyed and rebuilt, is already present in the engine and presents a serious level of persistence. So, if I have, just the BC3K fans (not a single new user), pay $10/month, with that kind of revenue, tell me, why the hell would I want to do a single-player title again - when I can just continue building, updating and enhancing my online world? Why do you think most companies are moving to MMPOG games?

Funny, in all this rhetoric, Tac's options for the relocation of the Rinaal SS, were the most clear and logical. So, lets go with Tac's option #2. I will edit the timeline above, accordingly. Now, lets move on to the next issue. Are we leaving Destiny where it is? I have no problems moving it, as long as it is logical and fits the timeline. Insurgent One, its your call. excellent!! dissertation Gallion! ...and btw, there no such entity as GCN. I don't want to see it used again. [This message has been edited by Supreme Cmdr (edited 03-23-2000).]

Dick, are u have trouble grasping what BC3K is? How can you ask if the BC Online world would be dynamic? Am I the only one getting increasingly confused by his posts?

btw, Ben, thanks for the GWII crash course. It seems feasible enough to work into the timeline, so, if we go with the fact that Wraith was destroyed by its commanders, that could have some serious repercussions. I don't like it because thats not the sort of thing a GALCOM commander of sound mind, would do. I'm going to stick to my Insurgent angle without the destruction of that station. Besides, you guys have no business destroying assets and cry foul when your RPG goes out of whack with my storyline. My storyline, of course, takes precedence. So, the capture of Wraith by the Insurgents, still stands as was originally written by me.

Karl, while I see your point, I don't think you need to worry about what the role of GALCOM is. Like every good story, it just so happens that in the span of 15 years, the Insurgents have become a major threat and therefore, that part of the story, is what is in focus - at this point. It doesn't take away from the other GALCOM duties. Ben, what the hell is GCN? Chaos, the Insurgent threat in space is not an EarthCom responsibility. Go back and read the history. They just happen to get involved due to GALCOM being stretched and because if EarthCom had kept them contained to Earth in the first place, they'd never have been powerful enough to be an opposing force of such strength in space. Besides, you keep forgeting, EarthCom and GALCOM don't even get along. And because the Empirians and the Vesperons ended up not even getting along, the very premise that is GALCOM, is on shaky ground - I have yet to figure out how I'm going to end that problem as well as grow GALCOM. Like every military body, GALCOM is just stretched and though they have several different divisions, it has come the point where you don't have a clue what every finger on that hand is doing. At the end of the day, if the Insurgents take Earth and overthrow the UFN, the first thing thats going to happen is the disbanding of GALCOM and EarthCOM. Stay focused guys.

Gallion, which part of the multiplayer specs for BCM, was unclear? Those features will debute long before I even finalize the design for BC:3020AD, which, incidentally, may never happen considering that it will probably end up being BC Online anyway. I probably won't even do a stand-alone game again, once I've got my console game out of the way. With BC Online, I will get a steady income stream as well as a platform that I can constantly update with new features, worlds, assets etc, without having to design a new game from scratch. Yes, you'll all get to give me $10.00 a month, before long, to put up with you lot (except for the beta testers of course). So, start saving. In BCM, you don't have to command a Battlecruiser if you don't want to. If you are piloting a cruiser, you don't have that much complexity, let alone playing as a trader, fighter pilot, marine etc. Weren't you paying any attention in class? Why do you think I'm ignoring Dick? OK, who had the dunce hat last? Pass it on to Gallion.

Anarchy!??! LOL!!

Once you guys tell me who is going to pay for this port development, I will consider it.

quote: New America was built as a joint venture between the Syrions and the Insurgents, No it wasn't. Its a military asset and the Syrions don't get involved in the military type conflicts amongst nations.

I am going to respond, collectively. NOTHING in your RP bears ANY relevance to my game history and/or premise. If you guys can't work around the relocation of Wraith or are not satisfied with my summary, blame Tac. Besides, I have no problems putting Wraith back where it was. The Syrions are not susceptible to the human emotions such as greed, clandestine ops etc. So, my explanation of how they allowed the Insurgents to build a station there, still stands. Naturally, if the Insurgents use it for military purposes and the Syrions find out about it, that station will have a short life. Even in multi-player, with NPCs activated, the Syrions can and will destroy it. Read your manuals before posting please and do not even think of changing the descriptions and/or premise of my alien nations of my world. That is not what this discussion is about. This discussion is about the plausibility of my extended timeline and how it fits with the premise going forward and of the new assets. The Syrions are vastly more advanced that the Terrans, hence, they are more advanced than the Insurgents - who are Terrans, in case you hadn't noticed. Gallion, your assumption as to why Wraith was deployed over there in the first place, is correct. Because Tac opted to move, I had no choice but to figure out why. And since you don't just up and move a station, given GALCOM's penchant for failure, my explanation seemed like a logical choice. Also, the Insurgent and Gammulan threat story is enough to xplain Wraith's failure to defend that station. The notion that Wraith was lost to the Insurgents does not reduce the Gammulan threat. Has it occured to you that the Insurgents, as crafty as they are, just waited for the Gammulans to weaken the station assets, and then just moved in for the kill while the Gammulans were regrouping for a final assault? And don't forget, now the Insurgents have the Gammulans to deal with. If GALCOM wanted that station back badly, they'd go and get it - or at least kill a few commanders, trying, wouldn't they? So far, they haven't decided this yet. I'd like to see a point-by-point brief explanation of GWII and I will consider working that RP timeline into this new one, if it is appropriate and in line with the new timeline premise. I have not read GWII, so I need a crash course without reading the whole thing and boring myself to tears.The same applies to BCT-D, whatever that is. Ron, I'm not sure I like your premise of the Insurgents leaving hapless POWs in ships, only to be destroyed. The Insurgents are not like that, nor are they ruthless commanders. So, I'd rather stick to the premise that the fleet was destroyed - whether they contained POWs or not, is irrelevant.I like the SCID involvement though. However, one has to ask, what is an SCID fleet, powerful enough to take out an entire Insurgent fleet (out of the question btw), doing in Pluto? Nah, don't like it. And if that was an act of retribution, it would do little to sway the minds of UFN who have agreed to keep EarthCom/SCID, at home. The SyrionsDroidans do not get involved in such matters and they don't support anything military related. In fact, in BCM, you won't see any of their ships outside their own galactic space, unless they are traders. I didn't suppress the creation of military assets in the BC3K v2.0x AG code, before, quite frankly, I forgot.Therefore, there is no chance of them supporting the Insurgents in their fight against the UFN. I think that the Insurgents do have that station as a trading outpost, unless they are willing to risk its destruction. Sure, they could be carrying out military research there, but the Syrions won't know that as long as the station flourishes as a trading outpost - which it does. The Insurgents are not stupid - you guys need to remember this. Never forget it.

Here is my revised storyboard, based on the events surrounding my allocation of new assets to the Insurgents. Issues such as the Orion and Wraith move, were worked in there, just recently, in order to make the premise more plausible. I also had to work in the formation of CIOPS. Had I not given Tac the OK to relocate and had the Insurgents not cried foul when I removed Destiny a few days ago and had Ristar not caused a commotion over losing SCID, I would not have had reason to address these three issues in the timeline. Things don't just happen in the BC world, which is why I am always hestitant to make radical changes. That said, these are written in stone to the extent that, as always, I am open to reasonable suggestions. As most of you know me by now, if its not reasonable, I'll just ignore it. Designing a world as complex as the BC3K one, takes years and I don't particularly want to ruin the integrity of my storyline and premise, with wanton acts of illogic. So, here it is. I have not yet finalized the actual dates yet, so I have not included them. However, remember that BCM starts in 3015AD, fifteen years after BC3K. btw, these are in no particular order. I just culled them from my notes. GALCOM lost Wraith during the 2nd Gammulan War. After the Fleet Commander of Wraith had blown up the station and withdrew to Sol space and the Gammulans retreated into their borders, a few months later, the insurgency scavenged the Wraith and re-built it into an operational station named it New Frontier. As if that wasn't enough, when news of a construction of a station in Uranus broke, nobody associated it with the Insurgents. For several years, the station was constructed as a trading outpost by a new corporation startup, based on Earth. With no apparent ties to the Insurgents, the UFN, wanting badly to have a trading outpost in Sol, sanctioned the construction of the station. Until a week after the construction was completed and the station opened for business, that the jump gate into Uranus, was mined and the entire region littered with Insurgent fleets. The corporation disappeared overnight and it was believed that it was a dummy setup in order to not raise suspicion during the construction of the station. A major coup for the Insurgents and testament to their ever growing threat. The SCID, whose job it was to distabilize as well as second guess the Insurgents, were obviously sleeping on the job and never saw that the Insurgents were actually scavanging the Wraith station or constructing Destiny. As a result, pretty much every high ranking official in SCID, was fired or re-assigned, taking along, several EarthCom officials with them. This provided an opportunity for GALCOM to stress the need to have Earthcom forces, resigned to Earth, rather than constantly stepping on the toes of GALCOM in the contested galaxy. Of course, as much as the UFN would have liked to not take blame for these instances, they had no choice but to rethink their strategy. GALCOM then decided to form CIOPS as their own counter-intelligence unit. No longer required to work with the SCID (it is at their discretion to request SCID assistance, rather than be stuck with working with them on orders from the UFN), GALCOM's credibility lies in the performance of CIOPS in order to ensure that acts such as the Fall of Wraith, (as it was known) and the building of hostile station in Earth space, did not occur. I mean, how do you maintain the cover-up of something as expansive as the building of a station, under wraps for the entire 18 months it takes to build it? Sure, neither the UFN, nor any entity for that matter, has any claims to any region of space, due to the on-going if you can defend it, you can keep it rule, but how could this possibly happen? The UFN now had an even larger threat, much closer to home and no matter how you look at it, the capture or destruction of Destiny, is a foregone conclusion. Finally, you have to wonder what Insurgent One is thinking, putting a station in Uranus, 1 jump from Earth, knowing fully well that the UFN would definitely give its destruction or capture, a high priority. Its not like he can amass a fleet there, knowing fully well that (a) they had 3 jump gates to defend and ( any Insurgent craft going into or out of Uranus, had to fight its way through Neptune, Pluto and/or Jupiter, in order to leave Sol. Unless of course, they knew something the UFN didn't. There is only a single known HSD artifact and that was already in the hands of the UFN. Apart from that, if the Insurgents had access to a similar technology (thats CIOPS job to find out) since it only operates on a single craft, not a fleet, they would most certainly have fitted it on all their primary vessels - which would have prevented the destruction and ambush of an entire entire Insurgent fleet (it is reported that none got away), in Pluto, several months ago. The UFN relocated Orion to Centris, in order to counter the new Insurgent threat in Midae. The UFN rebuilt a new Wraith station in Lyrius as a last line of defense into Sol. Since they couldn't tackle the Insurgent+Gammulan threat, the test is to see how they hold up against the Insurgents, one on one, this time, without having to deal with the Gammulans as well. ISS beefed up its prosecution of Insurgent assets in Uranus, from their base in Saturn - without much success. They can't even get into Uranus most of the time, due to mines, deployed around the jump gates. Every probe sent in there, gets destroyed within 2 mins of transmission. In an Act Of Council, the UFN converts the Velari trading station to a Military installation. That protest is still going on. The UFN have made several promises to build a new trading outpost in the region or elsewhere in Sol, but so far, have not lived up to its promises, citing economic and strategic issues - and as always, using the ever growing Insurgent threat as an excuse. Then came word of a top secret Insurgent installation in the new Insurgent station, New America. Deep within an asteroid and heavily defended in the Midae region, hardly anyone outside the Insurgent rank and file, have seen it, let alone step foot on it. Word has it that, deep within the asteroid, is a research base of ops. This in itself poses more questions as to why the Syrions even allowed the Insurgents to build a station, Alpha Prime, in Tarean. So far, all reports indicate that it is a trading outpost and this is confirmed by the Syrions. However, due to its classification as an Insurgent facility, as far as the UFN is concerned, it is a military base. So, in keeping with the tradition of pointing the finger, the UFN and the Syrion delegates are still debating the merits of this one. The Insurgents, of course, are attributing the presence of military ships in the region, to their need for defense. Oh well. CIOPS, recruiting commanders from the combined GALCOM forces are engaged in deep, deep cover, covert ops in all occupied Insurgent territories as well as Gammulan territories. Also, their assistance in the liberation of the Falkeries from Gammulan rule, continues - unsuccessfully. Now the SCID has to deal with destabilizing events at home, in relation to Insurgent infiltration of the rank and file, as well as assisting police forces in the infiltration and apprehension of raiders and other such threats to trading and diplomatic assets. There you have it. Quite a mess huh? [This message has been edited by Supreme Cmdr (edited 03-23-2000).]

This started off in another thread. At any rate, there has been much speculation as to how the Insurgents managed to build no less than 4 new stations during the span of 15 years with the main question being how the heck did Destiny get built around Uranus, 1 jump from Earth. As if that wasn't enough, considering the Syrion's low threshold for aggression, they mush have given the Insurgents permission to build Alpha Prime in Tarean And how did Wraith station at Rinaal, fall? Could the ever-growing Insurgent threat be the reason for GALCOM taking over the trading outpost, Velari, and converting it to a military station - as well as building a new station in Centris and relocating Orion there? I have a storyboard on this already - but, I'd like to be fair and give you guys, who built this community, a chance to shape the history of the game. Whatever the outcome, it will added to the history section of the BCM manual. Whatever you, please be logical. Ensigns, don't post unless you have an extensive idea of how the game history works and how the various entities affect the storyline. Here are some choice quotes from the other thread where this started. quote: And the reason I removed one of the stations was because I didn't want the Insurgents to be as powerful as GALCOM. However, since BCM starts off in 3015AD (the next title in the series, is of course, BC:3020AD), I figured, why not. GALCOM+EARTHCOM must have goofed somewhere - not unheard of. Anyway, I've been taking notes because I have to write in the timeline extension to explain: where the hell the Insurgents got the funding from where they got the technology for New America from how they got the Syrions to let them actually build a station in Tarean and where the hell was GALCOM when they were building Destiny - right in our backyard. quote: I tend to agree with GREGS assesmnent. Putting Destiny in the midst of all the GalCOm stations in the area seems a little far fetched. GalCom would have really had to mess up on it's intel to allow that to happen. quote: OK, thank you Derek for restoring Destiny. I owe You big time for that one! Now on to the how's and why's. why not give Destiny cloaking technology. Insurgents are resourceful, and we are natural born thieves when it comes to survival. Have to be. Could have stolen the cloaking technology from the gammulans. Did it already in an RP thread. Just a thought! quote: As far as where the Insurgents got all the money for funding.. well Galcom could have had a few commanders working secretly for the insurgents, funneling supplies and money to the enemy, before finally getting caught. Just where do you think all those $800 hammers went anyway quote: Errrr. Uhmmmm. Excuse me. {raises hand } But this is exactly why I wanted to be Storekeep. I knew the Insurgency would rely on trading for funding while Galcom had the UFN and taxes. RP only of course. This part of the Insurgency has been in place since the beginning (oops since Rattlers new beginning). It is not a far stretch to imagine that in 15 years (3000ad for 2.09 till 3015 for BCM) we could have raised those funds ourselves. I'm not above a few friends left in Galcom. The manual says so. Well pretty much. "Support for the Insurgents grew". So funding came from our own efforts and some from within Galcom perhaps. It's there if Derek wants to use it. Galcom cooperated with the Syrions and Droidans for the Atrian-Alloy hulls. Negotiations could have continued and allowed us the technology to build New Amerca. Again the support thing. So far as how we got into Syrion space I have no idea. A gratitude for a service perhaps? Where was Galcom? beats me quote: This is going kind of off topic, but it cries for some answer/question: how can Mars declare independence with Starpath in orbit, hosting two of the five Wings of Prime? Think of it, roughly 160 fully equipped ships (I assume 400 ships within Prime Fleet) use Starpath as home base, and thus have easy access to the planet itself... Now back to topic: Derek, if you really implemented Destiny as a cloaked station (like Gammula), we all await (in the RP forum, at least) the day when its cloaking device faults, of that of an arriving Insurgency squadron. I bet there are GALCOM/Earthcom probes all over the place within the Sol System!

quote: As far as where the Insurgents got all the money for funding.. well Galcom could have had a few commanders working secretly for the insurgents, funneling supplies and money to the enemy, before finally getting caught. Just where do you think all those $800 hammers went anywayFunny you should mention that (well, not funny, considering that you're a long standing community member), but that is exactly what I have in my notes. Lets move this over to the RP forum. It could get quite interesting.

Den Dee, you need to convert those to JPG format and then re-upload. This way, they can be viewed in the browser without having to download them. When u are done, simply edit the post and change the file extension.

You need the Map Pak, doh!

hehe, no problem...at least you didn't get busted down a rank.

I agree with Charles.

quote: Can I have CIOPS detached from ISS to go about it's missions and be a self supporting Wing, with a commander in charge? It still is a wing within ISS but I can let it answer directly to me as Cheif of Operations. I don't see why not - but please clarify detached. quote: Do I stay at rank of Strategic Commander and keep my title of Chief of Operations? No. Apart from that, I didn't even know that any fleet leader (RPG or not) was anything other than Fleet Commander rank. I am the only person who assigns ranks - and you will have to rely on your online persona to be promoted based on multiplayer performance and not some RPG storyline you guys have going. quote: I want to stay this rank and have Tringad keep Fleet Commander, because I think we've earned Excuse me for being ignorant, but please explain to me how anyone has earned a rank other than the Fleet Commander ranks I gave out, in lieu of this fleet structure clean up? If Tringad is leader of CIOPS, then his rank will remain Commander - Battle Group, CIOPS. Didn't I explain this already? That rank gives him control over his wing but since you didn't want anyone pulling rank, you and him are the same rank and therefore, you can't tell him what to do. Period. You should have thought about this before going all over the place and making this whole thing more complicated than it needs to be. Maybe we should make him Fleet Commander and bust you down to Commander Battle Group, CIOPS? quote: This might sound like I am being greedy I don't think you're being greedy, I just think that you are making things more complicated than they need to be - and I'm not alone in this assumption. As much as you would like to, you can't have everything. So, make up your mind. [This message has been edited by Supreme Cmdr (edited 03-21-2000).]

quote: Part of that it needs a commander that has a similiar rank to stand up to the ISS Fleet Commander so he won't have rank pulled on him and override him. That is the reason. I understand the concern but it is not reason enough to complicate the structure. So, my decision is final. We will have to come up with something later, regarding the rank issue. For now, we can assume that the Commander of a Battle Group and a Fleet Commander, are the same rank. [This message has been edited by Supreme Cmdr (edited 03-21-2000).]

There should only be a single Fleet Commander per fleet. I have not had time to even look at the fleet structures yet and was leaving that up to Rattler - to flag any inconsistencies. So, if there are more than 1, someone's getting fired. And there should NOT be any fleets within fleets - EVER. Wings are not necessarily used for fighters. So, either use wings or collapse CIOPS. That goes for both you and that other lady running EarthCom/SCID. If you don't like Wings, then use Battle Group - but whatever you do, I only want a single Fleet Leader per fleet. You could then replace your CIOPS Fleet Commander with a Commander - CIOPS Battle Group or Commander - SCID Battle Group. That rank is just a commander, who is in charge of other commanders and personnel in that battle group - so don't go screwing around with the established ranking system. And any member of any fleet, can be temporarily assigned to CIOPS or SCID based on requests or command re-assignment as is appropriate, and then back to their primary fleet once the assignment is over. Get creative gentlemen. [This message has been edited by Supreme Cmdr (edited 03-21-2000).]

OK, so, uhm, I guess Destiny is moving again then? Definitely not. I put it there for a specific reason. Of course they built it right under GALCOM's nose. Its either that or I have the Insurgents take Gazer1. That was would be far-fetched because somehow I don't see GALCOM allowing a station at a strategic location, to be captured - no matter how badly they screw up.

...I can't be bothered. The fact that you even compare EQ to a BC game, is proof positive that you must be on something stronger than EA. Its like saying that BC is a WC wannabe because they both take place in space. Or that noboby else should do MMPOG games because UO, EQ and AC are doing it. Dick, do any of your posts have any sliver of sensibility whatsoever, or do you just spew the first thing that comes to mind? It would help to think first, then post. [This message has been edited by Supreme Cmdr (edited 03-21-2000).]

Never

Someone please throw Chaos out the nearest airlock - I don't have a clue what he's blabbering about. Obviously has not been keeping up. Ristar, no. Can't have all the fleet stations being the same. [This message has been edited by Supreme Cmdr (edited 03-21-2000).]