Raven

You won't be in a box, but you will be in a box. Damn, that's a tough one. Oh, I got it. You won't be in the box because you'll be dead, but your body will be in a box.

Live with it. Or else use an older version of BCM.

quote: *eyes hurt now after reading so much* I never expected you guys to really talk about this.. it sirprise'd me It doesn't surprise me, starting a political thread is almost assured of getting you lots of responses around here. quote: Has anyone notice'd that how our country *USA* is not doing a damn thing to stop illigel imigation *Specking fondly of Hispanics* They come in with illigel papers and get a job, that job DOES NOT check to see if there legal or not cause they can pay the Hispanic only 5 dollers an hour. Well, this is more the government's job then that of companies, but I agree, it's repulsive. But wait, I have an idea, lets give them all amnesty again! quote: Its that reason why America is turning into ****. Corporations don't give a shit about there employees all they want to do is save a few bucks, so they hire someone LESS experience'd and Less qualifed than the person who has a Bachlers Degree and CCIS Degree. Well darling, they have a valid point, if they don't need someone with a bachelors degree then why should they dish out the extra cash that person is going to want. quote: Anyone ever had a problem where the school would FORCE you, yes I mean FORCE you to learn something?? well normaly im willing to learn a subject, but with what my school is doing is wrong, there forcing me to learn a language I don't WANT to learn. I want to learn Japanses,Germen, and Chnises*SP* those are the 3 languages that interest me the most, I don't want to learn a language that im not interested in. Yea, I had a similar experience myself, only we had the choice of Spanish or French, and I wanted Latin. I never did take a foreign language. quote: Rapists should have their nob choped off. Rapists should have there head shopped off or barring that they should be required to pay all expenses pertaining to the child. quote: Abortion is another word for murder. NO question about it. To terminate a child is to MURDER a child. Adoption is unfair and cruel. Being born then passed on to someone else is outright rejection of a person. WHY can't you see this! THESE TWO THINGS ARE WRONG!!!! How very stilted, abortion is wrong because fetuses are people too, adoption is wrong because the child should be left with a parent who doesn't want them and probably can't support them, and no doubt keeping an unwanted child is wrong too. Bleh! What a bunch of moral garbage. Morality is what you make of it, abortion is only wrong because you want it to be wrong, if you decided it was fine then it would be. The same with adoption. I, for one, refuse to accept either of these practices as wrong. On the other hand, increasing our already bloated population should be criminal. The world doesn't need more people. Now, before you start telling me that there is no good excuse for unwanted pregnancy (besides rape), think about it for a moment. Sex is a marvelous thing, a wonderful pleasure, but accidents are going to happen, and that means unwanted pregnancies. Now I agree people who have sex should be ready to deal with the consequences of such a mistake, but there are more ways to do that then by raising the brat. Just because you can't handle what's necessary doesn't mean that other people can't, and there is no good reason to have your morality shoved down everyone's throats. quote: Again, like I said, we need a higher standard in what is right and what is wrong publicaly presented. I agree, but I disagree on how. Our education system should present morality as it is a construct of social values that are beneficial to the society as a whole but often at the expense of the individual. Morality is what you make of it, and the only reason you view something as immoral is because you want to. I don't want to have your version of morality shoved down my throat, and I don't think very many people would either, but this is exactly what you want to do. quote: TV is a high source of coruption and so is the radio. Next time you turn the radio on, listen to what half the songs are about and you'll see what I mean why coruption spread publicaly. Bleh! TV is primarily low class garbage, and I don't much like mainstream music so I don't listen to the radio, but it hardly qualifies as corruption. But wait, were using a stagnant moral code that requires everyone to follow out dated social controls and be good social drones. I think I'm going to be ill. quote: THIS NEEDS TO BE CONTROLLED!!! Ok, I take that back, I know I'm going to be ill. Your need to control everyone is repulsive and highly undemocratic. If people enjoy watching trash on the television and listening to music you find offensive on the radio then it is there right to do so unmolested by crazed control freaks. quote: Children bearly in their teens are getting involved in relationships is not right. This is because of modern day acceptance. Well, if you're talking about girlfriend/boyfriend relationships then yea, that is widely accepted, but teens having sex usually isn't. None the less, there is nothing wrong with this, if they are consenting and if they arenÔÇÖt hurting anyone else then there activities are perfectly acceptable. quote: Young children listening to songs about cheating on boyfriends/girlfriends is not a good role model to live by. I haven't actually heard that many songs about cheating, though I prefer gothic rock myself and I'm not really all that familiar with mainstream music. Still, I don't see how this is a problem, they can listen to whatever they bloody well please. quote: What I'm saying is children should not be encourage to have sex at their young age. Darling, I think that the earth should orbit the sun. It's that peachy. Teens arenÔÇÖt encouraged to have sex at a young age, at least not that I've heard of, if anything it is discouraged. You're complaining about a problem that doesn't exist. quote: To be honest though, I dont give a S*** if they do, I just don't want to pay for their supidness. Having a child at their age is their choice not mine. They make the mistake, they pay for it! Yes, they should pay for the abortion or for the government to support the child until it's adopted. Oh, but that's right, abortion and adoption are wrong. quote: You'll never find me down a church but is does has some good standards which if followed provide a better lifestyle for all of us. For anyone to be able to live together in harmony we need a set of rules of what is right and what is wrong. The church provides these rules. What the church has is a bunch of moral rules that are pretty much hard and fast, though in truth nothing about the world is hard and fast like that. Furthermore, a lot of those rules are outdated and unnecessary, but don't get updated because of the stagnant nature of religion. quote: My point was that they do their job when on the stand. I know that they're after re-election, but thats why most politicians hire people to do the work related to re-elections for them. Ever heard of a Campaign Manager? They do there job, but that also do what will be necessary for there reelection (again, gerrymandering and pork barrel politics come to mind). quote: Economies work by supply and demand. Are you familiar with Supply and Demand Graphs? Often, they have floors and ceilings caused by uncontrollable forces that keep it from reaching equilibrium. I personally feel that if you could graphically represent regulation that one of those floors or ceilings is whats causing the balance from not being met. Well darling, I'm no economist, but I have a fair idea of what you're talking about. I disagree about regulations however; things will always be in a state of flux. quote: The constitution has to be revised to fit the time. If we still were following the constitution we'd still be in a dark age. Your a woman right? You'd still have no rights. Times call for changes, the fact that the government has to spend like this is a need for change. Nonsense, out constitution has been updated through amendment, this is good. The problem is when (as is happening more and more today) politicians ignore the constitution. quote: Let me tell you a little story of a friend of mine. His last name is Smith (I'm holding his first for his security), and he's has a wife and two teenage girls. One of his daughters has an anxiety disorder that hospitalized her for some time. Last year, the day after Christmas, he had a seizure caused by a brain tumor. He lost his job, which paid only enough to support his family, and he had outrageous doctor's bills to pay. His wife, who was currently going to school in hope to get a degree to better their life, had to drop her classes in order to get a job to support the family. He was unable to go back to work at his old job, since he could not lift anything heavy. It took him 4 months to get a job that could pay enough, WITH his wife still having to work as well, to support his family. Welfare helped them through a lot of this; without it, they probably would be living in the slums somewhere. They are still trying to pay bills to this date, and its almost been a year. Thats why welfare exhists, I don't think I need to say much more. Very touching, but it doesn't mean much to me. I don't pretend to be a compassionate person and it's not my responsibility to pay to deal with other peoples problems. I won't say that they should have planed ahead, or that they should have had money saved up, maybe they couldn't, but that's the way it goes. Life is full of tragedies; it's not my job to finance them. quote: Where did you get the idea that I'm promoting fascism? All I'm saying is the system is corupt and needs to address more morality views to its laws. Darling, what you're advocating is imposing your rigid and outdated moral code on an unwilling populace. That's not exactly fascism, but it's in the same ballpark. The system isn't corrupt, at least not in the way you think it is, but I'll tell you a little something about the type of excessive government control you're advocating, it tends to lead to real corruption and to some serious problems for the population in general. quote: There is so much now that people except as right that they don't even know that it's wrong (take Dragonlady for example). Please darling, spare me. I know perfectly well what's right and what's wrong, I simply disagree with you on what that is. quote: If you think abortion is wrong, why do you support it as a free right to people? It's wrong and therefore should not be allowed at all! Well, darling, as long as it's you who's deciding what's right and what's wrong it's peachy, after all you know what's right and what's wrong for everyone. The problem with your little philosophy is that you're not the only one with ideas of what's right and what's wrong. How would you like living in a country in which my views on morality were imposed? I don't think you would. But that's not the worst of it, if someone who cared less for morality then for there own personal control came to power then it's goodbye rights, disagreeing with the government is now immoral and thus illegal.

LMAO, that's rich darling, truly.

quote: Just who are these REAL americans? Stuff like that makes my blood boil. If anyone has created "sheeple" (a truly disgusting term) It's been the corporations who have been successful in the "Malling" of our country turning it into a idolatrous , materialistic , me first society that is more concerned about the aquisition of things than they are about people. I'm not sure, I imagine Jaguar was speaking of people who are patriots and who believe in the precepts of this country and all of that. As for corporations turning our population into an ovine heard (thanks again Paddy Gregory), you forgot to mention TV (trashvision). It's easily the most degenerate form of entertainment that has ever been available, ever, and it's produced in huge quantities. quote: So your saying it's sensible that kids can do what they want and have babies in their teens when their not able to support them and then end up having to give them away for adoption. No, this is NOT right because the baby will be born unwanted. Imagine how you would feel to have been born not actually wanted but just because two teens wanted to have a moment of fun! The money to pay for the adoption should be paid fully by those who are stupid enough to land themselves in a situation where they have a child they cannot support. If you make a mistake, you should pay for it. I also feel that any man who is the father of any child that is adopted should pay child support for that child until the kid is of a certain age where they can look after themselves. WHY should I pay for other peoples mistakes. Darling, you're preaching to the choir. I'm a firm believer in not paying for other peoples mistakes, in any form. That said, abortion seams to be an ideal solution for everyone, it gets rid of the unwanted baby, it prevents financial strain on everyone, and it helps with the population problem. quote: I'm talking standards that should be employed everywhere. Children should be advised about wearing protection but NOT encouraged! I would not want my daughter having a child when she's in her teens and then having to give it away. Darling, I'm missing something here. You want teens to have sex without protection? No? Well that's what you're advocating. I'll let you in on a little secret about condoms; the only failure is operator failure. I'll let you in on another little secret, no one is encouraging teens to have sex, only to use protection when they do (and, perhaps more importantly, making sure they know how). Now, it seams to me that this is advantageous. Teens are going to have sex, nothing you can do about that and, so long as they take proper precautions, there's nothing wrong with it. quote: Having sensible standards is controling these problems. Allowing people to be free but not allowing them to hurt themselves or others. People can hurt themselves as much as they like, it's there right and privilege as human beings, but I agree, they shouldn't be allowed to hurt others (or more to the point, they shouldn't be allowed to hurt me, I really couldn't care less what they do to each other). quote: You may laugh at the church, but isn't your country supposed to be a GOD loving country. Ours was once but now it is corupted and that is why the system is going down. GOD? Sorry darling, I'm not familiar with that acronym. Seriously though, I couldn't care less about religion, unless someone is trying to stuff there morals down my throat, then I find religion real easy to loath. quote: I don't think a single one of them has mentioned anything about re-election while on the stand? Of course not, but that would be self defeating. What about the pork barrel politics, the gerrymandering, is that all just for something to do with there spare time? Didn't think so. Of course they're after reelection, it's a fundamental part of our system (you do what the people want because you want to be reelected), but the thing is that our population doesn't care much about the constitution either. quote: Regulation is important. Without regulation we'd have one company owning the entire nation. Take Microsoft for example, had they not been punished for their illegal actions then in about, oh say 20 years we could well be STUCK with using the shoddy Windows operating system. Agreed, ideals never work, be it an unregulated economy or a totally government controlled one. The trick is to find the best balance, and I don't believe that is being done. quote: Taxes are also important. Have you ever heard of the government deficit. Its one reason for inflation. Taxes help to lower the addition to the deficit by supporting government programs. And, as I'm sure Jaguar will tell you, we need to reduce government spending. Reducing taxes would be nice, reducing spending is essential. The federal government was never supposed to be able to spend like this, just pick up a copy of the constitution and you'll figure that out. quote: Welfare, I feel is abused. I also think its something that should not be removed, but revised. Too many people start getting welfare checks then sitting on their asses. But thats not the government's problem completely. Granted, they could revise the system, but its the citizens problem mainly. Yes darling, welfare could be made better, and if nothing else is possible that is an option, but the question is why have welfare to begin with? Why should I have to dish out money to prop up, or even help support, some looser who can't get a job that pays enough? Or who has too many children? This is no ones responsibility but the person who it happens to. quote: I don't think that getting rid of welfare will help the taxation problem either. Taxes should still stay the same for the sake of trying to get rid of the deficit. Peachy, I have no problem with that, if the government could reduce it's spending to a more appropriate level and keep taxes the same to get rid of the deficit then that would be great. Even building up a surplus would be nice. I don't much like the idea of paying for decades of wasteful spending, but if that's what it takes, then that's what it takes. quote: The American people never lost their drive, most never had one. Its the people like you and me that make changes. That doesn't mean the others arn't American, they just are too uneducated to really care. So very true. None the less, the government is making it a lot easier to have less drive and survive. quote: Adoption is an alternative, but some people feel better by aborting the child. Don't know why, I don't ask, but I'm sure they have their reasons. Don't forget what a blast pregnancy is supposed to be, avoiding that is excuse enough for an abortion. quote: If you really think they don't give you any type of service or anything, then you really need to look into the matters. Or move. quote: Thats what I feel, if you feel insulted, fine, I get insulted during debates with people all the time. You've said nothing insulting, trust me on that.

Well, if it keeps moral up you can tell everyone that salvage crew is there to recover me; I won't let your little secret out.

Thank you darling, I knew bovine meant cattle, but I wasn't aware that ovine meant sheep. I don't think it matters really for what I'm saying though.

Well, I was looking through the VCF today while downloading the newest patch (I haven't updated in a while I'm afraid) and I noticed that the max speed for a probe was increased from 15,000 to 75,000 in RC25. This change is not reflected in the appendix.

Well thank you Sir, I hope I live up to you expectations, and I think I can safely say that this will be a pleasure. As for the head, well, if it's destroyed the first time perhaps they'll clone him and I'll have another shot at it, no pun intended.

LMAO See, I told you it was a good plan

quote: I say immoral as it is to the catholic church. I myself am not catholic but still belive in standards. People who have a child at a bad time should have worn protection to prevent pregnacy and school kids should buy their own F***ing contraceptives, why should I pay for them! I have standards too darling, but I'm more sensible about that kind of thing then you. People should be able to do whatever they like, within reason, so long as they don't go around blatantly doing antisocial activities (murder, rape, theft, etc.). As for the catholic church, well, I couldn't care less what there ideas of morality are, unless I want a good laugh. Besides, the way the system works these days you either pay a few cents for contraceptive or else you pay through the nose for teen mothers to raise there brats on welfare, or better yet they get put up for adoption and guess who pays for them until they get dumped on some one, that's right, the taxpayers. quote: More to the point, the money could be better spent elsewhere. Our NHS for example! My mother who had breast cancer spent 6 hours waiting in the hospital only to be told that they could not see her on that day. The waiting times have gone up. You're not talking about government run hospitals are you? Bleh! Step up the bureaucratic inefficiency. Besides, I don't believe breast cancer requires immediate treatment, though I can understand your sentiments. quote: The straw that breaks the camels back is coming, it is only a matter of time. The question is are we going to have enough REAL americans to fight to get our country back, or has the government succeeded in making enough sheeple, where they can pretty much do whatever they want? Sheeple, I like that, it's so fitting. The government doesn't have to do all that much to make people into sheep, they're already pretty bovine to begin with, but I would have to say that should such a revolution occur it wouldn't have a very good chance of succeeding unless it was in the form of a military coup, and that has its own problems.

What you really mean to say is that you'll take on all of the Gammulan fleet and they'll clone you in time for breakfast.

Oh dear, this is just lovely. Nice quotes Menchise, a pleasant change to see you post something I like even if I can't agree with all of it. LBM, what can I say, I don't know much about England, but I'm not sure I agree with some of your sentiments. There is nothing immoral about abortion; it's much better then having another unwanted child who is going to turn into a dysfunctional adult. Think of it as preemptive execution. As for contraception to school children, it's better then if they need it and don't have it. We don't need more useless people (except maybe to increase property prices, but that's something else entirely). As for taxes, well, whatever works. Just make sure you don't get in trouble and that the effort to avoid paying taxes is worth the money saved.

Develop a taste for extremely spicy food that you can only eat a very small amount of. It works, at least most of the time. I eat jalape├▒o peppers out of the jar, though I might have to get something a bit hotter soon.

I wouldn't get another saitek. I've never had one myself, but I have been told by numerous different people that they break down real easy like, and even if you can use two joysticks at once I don't know of any games that support that (though I can see the use). I got myself a Gravis Eliminator Precision Pre a while back (shortly after I got BCM as I recall) and it's a wonderful choice (especially considering it was only $15). It has twist, a throttle, an 8 way hat switch, something that resembles a mousewheel, and 8 other buttons.

quote: YouÔÇÖre just wrong. Income does not facility vertical mobility, wealth does. So unless youÔÇÖre in the upper 40% you can expect to little to no wealth generation. Well darling, wealth certainly doesn't hurt, but you hardly need to be in the upper 40% to save money, it's just that so many people would rather buy what they want now then save for the future. I don't mind though, makes it easier for those of use with intelligence. Furthermore, wealth is not the only thing that facilitates vertical mobility, ambition, intelligence, and a good education (which is easy enough to get if you have ambition and intelligence) are big factors as well. quote: you always seem to have facts that are inaccurate or do not address fundamental issues. And you're the master of accurate and unbiased information presented in such a manner so as not to appear to be other then what it is? I think not. quote: One day you may realize that there are just not enough jobs for everyone and that the majority of poor people are guiltily of nothing save the accident of birth. Darling, the majority of the people are guilty of failure, incompetence, bovine stupidity, and poor economic decisions. Of course how much money you're born to makes a difference, but plenty of people manage without being rich to begin with, and plenty of others go down the tube no matter what. quote: Technology is voiding more jobs than it is creating. But it's also advancing our standard of living. If you're so object to technology then I'm sure you can find a cave somewhere to live. quote: Capital migration (jobs) is moving over seas to remain competitive. That's blue collar and white collar....what is cheaper? Paying for a computer scientist to come live in America or just take the jobs to them? Well darling, what can I say; it's often a better economic decision to move to other countries, though I believe this is more for cheap labor then anything else. The government likes to regulate, and to control, and to make things difficult to do business. That's peachy, because companies no longer have to put up with that if there is a better regulatory environment elsewhere. It's what Jaguar would call voting with your feet. quote: The Republicans will continue to pass laws that funnel wealth back into the hands of the wealthy and keep labor disorganized. Polarize wealth, eviscerate the middle class, and generally destabilize society....they can't help it, that's the nature of fat cat politics. Yes darling, they're polarizing wealth and eviscerating the middle class, which is why your lovely statistics show that even the bottom 20% economically are making more money now then they were in the past, after inflation. At least try and appear consistent. quote: When the majority of people who are used to being consumers fall off the tread mill they will take a very hard look at what they believe and who is telling them to believe it.... Bah! Nonsense, I believe we have already covered that humans are complacent, bovine, and not all that hard to shove around. It's repulsive, but it's the truth for the majority of our population.

Yea, that is pathetic, I have to go with Jaguar, that fool has no business being a majority leader. Besides, affirmative action is complete nonsense and a little disgusting.

Please darling, don't bother, the last thing I need is your pity. It we're going to be talking about rude, however, you may want to note that not all of us use flagrant amounts of insults in our arguments and suggesting that we do is mildly offensive. Now, that said, Jaguar is in a perfectly understandable position. Some of the leftists on this forum are communists (namely Menchise), and most of the leftist ideas seam naïve and at times inane. It's easy to switch over from amused to disgusted, especially if everything is getting heated. Besides, it's not just the rights that do this, you leftist types do that as well. My advice is that if you can't handle it don't get involved. It's easy and it works.

Well said Jaguar

Ug, I feel ill...

Well, it's about time. Unfortunately that article is rather blatantly biased. They say how the poor pay more of there income in sales tax, well sure, that's because they buy more taxable items, and let me assure you that the wealthy pay a much larger amount of sales tax, just not a larger percent of there income. Yet somehow this is unfair, because after all, taxes should always favor the poor. Now, maybe I'm missing something here, but wealthy people pay property taxes (bleh!), disgustingly tiered income taxes that are enough to make you weep, they pay more money total in just about every single tax no matter what the percentage is, and yet the poor are the ones who need tax breaks. Its rubbish, just because someone makes a dreadfully small amount of money doesn't free them from paying there fair share of taxes. I'm not expecting this kind of taxing to generate any considerable amount of income, that's just not going to happen, but the principle of the matter stands. Poor people pay to little taxes, especially income taxes, and it's about time it changed. By the way, have a look at some of the other stuff this Dionne Jr. character has written of late, it's simply repulsive, not to mention wildly inaccurate and blatantly leftist propaganda. Seriously bleh! [ 12-16-2002, 10:54 AM: Message edited by: Dragon Lady ]

Oh dear, what a pity, we're going seriously consider that Die Another Day is slanderous to Korea when they're producing that filth about use. "The root cause of all disasters and misfortunes of the Korean nation", give me a break!

Commander Raven of the Violon GMV Dragon's Daughter reporting all systems and personnel combat ready. We are currently in orbit around Zelana in the Lanix V system.

Oh dear, I knew this was going to happen

It's in with all the other fleet forums.